00:00:15.000 --> 00:00:17.120
BELL RINGS

00:00:17.160 --> 00:00:18.920
LIVELY CHATTER

00:00:21.960 --> 00:00:25.320
PA: ..please wait outside
the building...

00:00:31.680 --> 00:00:33.960
RINGING STOPS

00:00:34.000 --> 00:00:35.440
But one thing, right?

00:00:35.480 --> 00:00:37.320
50 of us lot get on a bus

00:00:37.360 --> 00:00:39.400
and the whole world
knows we're lesbians.

00:00:39.440 --> 00:00:41.480
There's no mistake about it.
They know what we are.

00:00:41.520 --> 00:00:44.400
We're out of the closet,
wearing what we're wearing.

00:00:44.440 --> 00:00:46.480
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

00:00:49.680 --> 00:00:52.400
I'm saying that you're
discounting and trivialising

00:00:52.440 --> 00:00:55.760
a whole other range
of sexual feelings.

00:00:55.800 --> 00:00:57.600
BELL RINGS

00:01:02.200 --> 00:01:03.960
Do you call yourself
a lezzo dyke?

00:01:05.120 --> 00:01:06.120
Yes.

00:01:08.920 --> 00:01:11.000
I'm not saying,
"Tell me what you do in bed,

00:01:11.040 --> 00:01:13.440
"and why is it better
and why is mine wrong?"

00:01:14.600 --> 00:01:16.720
I... I just want to say
one other thing.

00:01:16.760 --> 00:01:18.800
ROWDY CHATTER

00:01:22.400 --> 00:01:24.280
-..attack.
-No, I don't.

00:01:24.320 --> 00:01:25.440
I just said to you...

00:01:25.480 --> 00:01:28.040
-Can we listen
to what's being said?

00:01:29.360 --> 00:01:31.880
MUSIC: I Hate Being In Love
by Amy And The Angels

00:01:39.160 --> 00:01:40.840
♪ I hate being in love

00:01:41.960 --> 00:01:43.680
♪ I hate being in love

00:01:44.760 --> 00:01:46.320
♪ I hate being in love

00:01:46.360 --> 00:01:47.600
♪ Oo-ee-oo

00:01:47.640 --> 00:01:49.200
♪ I hate being in love

00:01:50.360 --> 00:01:51.520
♪ One of my friends has told me

00:01:51.560 --> 00:01:52.640
♪ It is such good fun

00:01:52.680 --> 00:01:53.960
♪ First you've got to see her

00:01:54.000 --> 00:01:55.720
♪ And then you're on the run

00:01:55.760 --> 00:01:56.880
♪ Every other weekend

00:01:56.920 --> 00:01:58.280
♪ They ask me, "How'd it go?

00:01:58.320 --> 00:01:59.600
♪ "Isn't it fantastic?"

00:01:59.640 --> 00:02:01.400
♪ And I say, "No, no, no," cos

00:02:01.440 --> 00:02:02.920
♪ I hate being in love

00:02:04.160 --> 00:02:05.800
♪ I hate being in love

00:02:06.920 --> 00:02:08.360
♪ I hate being in love

00:02:08.400 --> 00:02:09.560
♪ Oo-ee-oo

00:02:09.600 --> 00:02:11.120
♪ I hate being in love

00:02:12.160 --> 00:02:13.480
♪ You hold my hand and kiss me

00:02:13.520 --> 00:02:14.960
♪ You buy me ice-cream cones

00:02:15.000 --> 00:02:16.520
♪ You also write me letters

00:02:16.560 --> 00:02:17.800
♪ And say you miss my bones

00:02:17.840 --> 00:02:18.960
♪ I can't say I might move

00:02:19.000 --> 00:02:20.200
♪ I'm saying I don't know

00:02:20.240 --> 00:02:21.760
♪ It's strange, somewhat uneasy

00:02:21.800 --> 00:02:23.680
♪ I can't ask you, no, no, cos

00:02:23.720 --> 00:02:25.160
♪ I hate being in love

00:02:26.400 --> 00:02:27.920
♪ I hate being in love

00:02:29.000 --> 00:02:30.720
♪ I hate being in love

00:02:30.760 --> 00:02:31.960
♪ Oo-ee-oo

00:02:32.000 --> 00:02:33.760
♪ I hate being in love. ♪

00:02:37.000 --> 00:02:38.800
We weren't lesbians -
we were dykes.

00:02:40.160 --> 00:02:42.120
We wanted to be sexual people.

00:03:00.320 --> 00:03:02.720
Rebel dykes were outlaws.

00:03:02.760 --> 00:03:06.480
This was way before there were
queer activists or riot grrls.

00:03:06.520 --> 00:03:07.520
We invented it.

00:03:13.400 --> 00:03:16.760
MUSIC: He Called Me
A Fat Pig... by the Renees

00:03:31.640 --> 00:03:34.000
It was a great time
and a terrible time

00:03:34.040 --> 00:03:37.200
to be young and queer
in London.

00:03:39.800 --> 00:03:43.480
Obviously, there was Thatcher -
that was a common enemy.

00:03:44.680 --> 00:03:46.880
Thatcher had just got in
in 1979.

00:03:46.920 --> 00:03:49.960
We're on the street,
we were working class.

00:03:50.000 --> 00:03:52.440
-We were young, we were punks,
we were poor.

00:03:54.440 --> 00:03:56.280
-We were a kind of subculture.

00:03:58.720 --> 00:03:59.800
-We were a community,

00:03:59.840 --> 00:04:02.240
because there were so many laws
made against us.

00:04:05.000 --> 00:04:08.360
-Politically, there was always
this attempt to silence.

00:04:08.400 --> 00:04:10.920
MUSIC: Life - No
by the Petticoats

00:04:13.120 --> 00:04:15.280
We had to ring Lesbian Line

00:04:15.320 --> 00:04:18.160
to find out where there
might be a dyke bar.

00:04:25.560 --> 00:04:28.520
I came to London

00:04:28.560 --> 00:04:32.000
in the mid-'70s and, um,

00:04:32.040 --> 00:04:33.880
I didn't know any other
lesbians.

00:04:33.920 --> 00:04:35.440
There weren't
any other lesbians,

00:04:35.480 --> 00:04:37.880
as far as I was aware -
I was actually the only one.

00:04:40.000 --> 00:04:41.640
So it was very difficult.

00:04:41.680 --> 00:04:44.400
Cos there was nowhere to go,
there was no clubs,

00:04:44.440 --> 00:04:47.720
there was...
It was really isolated.

00:04:49.560 --> 00:04:52.000
-I was living in quite a
conservative town

00:04:52.040 --> 00:04:54.200
just outside Winchester.

00:04:54.240 --> 00:04:58.320
I had seen a woman in the town
who I liked, who was

00:04:58.360 --> 00:05:00.560
cycling around dressed
all in black,

00:05:00.600 --> 00:05:03.480
with a great chain
strung across her.

00:05:03.520 --> 00:05:06.640
And, um, obviously developed
a massive crush on her.

00:05:09.000 --> 00:05:11.800
The only problem was, she was
about 15 years older than me

00:05:11.840 --> 00:05:14.160
and she said, "Go to Greenham."

00:05:22.520 --> 00:05:26.440
Greenham Common was
a women's peace camp and, um,

00:05:26.480 --> 00:05:29.720
you wanted to go and join
and live there.

00:05:29.760 --> 00:05:32.040
♪ We are strong, we are strong

00:05:32.080 --> 00:05:35.440
♪ We say "no", we say "no"

00:05:35.480 --> 00:05:38.440
♪ To the bomb, to the bomb

00:05:38.480 --> 00:05:41.400
♪ We are women, we are women

00:05:41.440 --> 00:05:42.560
♪ We are strong... ♪

00:05:42.600 --> 00:05:44.840
FISCH: Women came from
everywhere. Hundreds and...

00:05:44.880 --> 00:05:46.240
Thousands of women came.

00:05:47.800 --> 00:05:50.840
♪ To the bomb, to the bomb

00:05:50.880 --> 00:05:52.200
♪ We are women... ♪

00:05:53.360 --> 00:05:58.600
Suddenly, there I was with
all these other lesbians

00:05:58.640 --> 00:06:01.280
and women who thought
they might be lesbians.

00:06:01.320 --> 00:06:03.240
It was like a ready-made
community.

00:06:03.280 --> 00:06:05.720
MUSIC: Statement
by the Poison Girls

00:06:16.000 --> 00:06:19.280
It was that version of being
a woman and then later,

00:06:19.320 --> 00:06:21.080
sort of, realised that version
of being

00:06:21.120 --> 00:06:24.440
a dyke that really made me
want to go there and live there

00:06:24.480 --> 00:06:27.400
more than the nuclear protest,
if I'm honest.

00:06:33.720 --> 00:06:36.000
We were reclaiming that land

00:06:36.040 --> 00:06:38.960
by putting women's energy
into it.

00:06:40.040 --> 00:06:43.040
We really needed to reclaim
space then.

00:06:43.080 --> 00:06:45.680
Everything seemed to be
owned by the patriarchy.

00:06:45.720 --> 00:06:48.080
CHANTING: Lesbians!

00:06:48.120 --> 00:06:49.960
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

00:06:50.000 --> 00:06:52.040
And I was a separatist then.

00:06:52.080 --> 00:06:54.040
You know, I wouldn't even
have had a male cat.

00:06:57.000 --> 00:06:59.360
There were eight gates,

00:06:59.400 --> 00:07:01.280
you know, all the colours of
the rainbow,

00:07:01.320 --> 00:07:03.320
around the base.

00:07:03.360 --> 00:07:05.320
Orange Gate was
the musicians' gate.

00:07:16.000 --> 00:07:18.680
-Green Gate was the notorious
gate of separatists.

00:07:26.760 --> 00:07:29.120
-There was a brand of feminism

00:07:29.160 --> 00:07:32.080
which said that you had to be
a lesbian.

00:07:35.000 --> 00:07:36.880
-Their view is that lesbianism

00:07:36.920 --> 00:07:39.640
is a political as much as
a sexual identity.

00:07:39.680 --> 00:07:42.240
It's about giving
all of your energy,

00:07:42.280 --> 00:07:45.280
all of your identity
to your sisters,

00:07:45.320 --> 00:07:48.760
and withdrawing from men and
male behaviour

00:07:48.800 --> 00:07:49.960
as much as possible.

00:07:50.000 --> 00:07:52.640
-After that, I moved
to Blue Gate,

00:07:52.680 --> 00:07:54.920
where there were
far more younger women.

00:07:55.960 --> 00:07:58.520
-Blue Gate was the gate
nearest the pub,

00:07:58.560 --> 00:08:01.160
so that was, like, your young
drinking lesbians' gate.

00:08:02.880 --> 00:08:05.280
-We weren't really into that
sort of

00:08:05.320 --> 00:08:07.840
Housewives For Peace
kind of image.

00:08:07.880 --> 00:08:09.560
♪ Whisky makes you frisky

00:08:09.600 --> 00:08:11.480
♪ Gin makes you sin

00:08:11.520 --> 00:08:13.160
♪ Brandy makes you randy

00:08:13.200 --> 00:08:14.560
♪ And rum makes you... ♪

00:08:18.000 --> 00:08:19.920
After school on a Friday,

00:08:19.960 --> 00:08:22.440
I'd get on the bus and up to
Greenham,

00:08:22.480 --> 00:08:24.680
spend the weekend there

00:08:24.720 --> 00:08:27.800
and then come back to school
on the Monday morning.

00:08:27.840 --> 00:08:30.000
So I did that as often as
I could, really.

00:08:30.040 --> 00:08:32.320
One time - I can't remember who
it was said,

00:08:32.360 --> 00:08:34.840
"Come on, come with me,
let's go and get some booze,"

00:08:34.880 --> 00:08:36.760
and just took me
into the woods.

00:08:36.800 --> 00:08:38.520
And it turns out that a group
of women

00:08:38.560 --> 00:08:42.600
had broken into the
squaddies' bar, essentially,

00:08:42.640 --> 00:08:45.880
and nicked all of their
alcohol - just the lot.

00:08:47.720 --> 00:08:50.400
FISCH: We were very
politically aware

00:08:50.440 --> 00:08:53.680
but we were also
really naughty.

00:08:53.720 --> 00:08:55.080
We just...

00:08:55.120 --> 00:08:59.280
We took great delight in really
just winding them up.

00:09:04.680 --> 00:09:08.040
One year, they brought over
this Blackbird spy plane

00:09:08.080 --> 00:09:11.040
that had this special skin
on it which meant that it could

00:09:11.080 --> 00:09:13.200
fly at
particularly fast speeds.

00:09:17.040 --> 00:09:19.720
About six of us
broke into the base one night

00:09:19.760 --> 00:09:23.080
and threw paint at this plane,
which...

00:09:23.120 --> 00:09:25.800
The level of damage
to this skin

00:09:25.840 --> 00:09:28.080
was in the, kind of,
multimillions.

00:09:30.760 --> 00:09:34.440
They bailed us but the prospect
was of, kind of,

00:09:34.480 --> 00:09:37.600
going to prison for, like,
25 years or something.

00:09:39.440 --> 00:09:41.160
-There was a nine-mile fence,
remember,

00:09:41.200 --> 00:09:43.000
so it was impossible for them

00:09:43.040 --> 00:09:45.840
to control that amount
of perimeter.

00:09:45.880 --> 00:09:48.480
So you'd just go to a bit where
there weren't any patrols

00:09:48.520 --> 00:09:51.160
and you'd get your bolt cutters
out and in you'd go.

00:09:54.640 --> 00:09:57.000
So we were just crawling around
in the base, you know,

00:09:57.040 --> 00:10:00.160
planting acorns in circles
on the full moon.

00:10:02.600 --> 00:10:05.680
-The first time
I had sex was in the base.

00:10:05.720 --> 00:10:09.360
So, went in, with this woman
who I fancied -

00:10:09.400 --> 00:10:11.400
"Oh, I've never
had sex before."

00:10:11.440 --> 00:10:13.760
And it was all smoky and misty
all around us.

00:10:13.800 --> 00:10:15.520
So that was quite exciting.

00:10:19.360 --> 00:10:21.520
ATALANTA: Some of the older
women, sort of, like,

00:10:21.560 --> 00:10:25.040
decided that they would tell us
all about lesbian sex.

00:10:32.000 --> 00:10:34.760
We were told that we
had to keep our nails short

00:10:34.800 --> 00:10:39.920
and one of the few women that
was into SM, who was a vegan,

00:10:39.960 --> 00:10:43.800
showed us how to make whips out
of rubber and things like that.

00:10:43.840 --> 00:10:46.440
So, that was a happy time.

00:10:46.480 --> 00:10:49.040
I met loads of fantastic women

00:10:49.080 --> 00:10:51.600
who were squatting in London
at the time.

00:10:53.200 --> 00:10:55.280
I ended up
squatting in Brixton.

00:11:00.480 --> 00:11:02.960
JO: There was a lot of empty
buildings in Brixton.

00:11:04.400 --> 00:11:06.680
Some landlords
that weren't there

00:11:06.720 --> 00:11:09.000
and just leaving their
properties empty.

00:11:21.960 --> 00:11:24.640
-I hitchhiked from Finland.

00:11:24.680 --> 00:11:29.040
We came to London and we didn't
know where to sleep.

00:11:29.080 --> 00:11:32.200
And we walked through Brixton,
with my friend Emma,

00:11:32.240 --> 00:11:34.320
and she took us to Tulse Hill.

00:11:34.360 --> 00:11:37.040
And she said, "Wait here,"
and she came back

00:11:37.080 --> 00:11:40.040
with a crowbar hidden, like,
under her jacket.

00:11:40.080 --> 00:11:43.080
So, she broke in very quick,
changed the lock and said,

00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:45.280
"OK, here's your new
apartment."

00:11:45.320 --> 00:11:47.320
SEIJA CHUCKLES

00:11:50.720 --> 00:11:54.800
It was good to open them up
and give them some life, erm,

00:11:54.840 --> 00:11:57.280
and we needed
somewhere to live.

00:12:02.520 --> 00:12:04.160
You know,
London was different then.

00:12:04.200 --> 00:12:05.960
It was harder to get around.

00:12:09.240 --> 00:12:11.960
And it was dirtier,
it was meaner.

00:12:14.360 --> 00:12:16.760
-Especially in south London,
at that time,

00:12:16.800 --> 00:12:21.000
there was still quite
a risk of being gay-bashed.

00:12:23.400 --> 00:12:24.920
-It was easier to be nocturnal,

00:12:24.960 --> 00:12:27.640
so that the straight people
didn't ever get to see you.

00:12:29.680 --> 00:12:31.960
-In those days,
people were very homophobic,

00:12:32.000 --> 00:12:33.960
so there'd be always people
shouting remarks

00:12:34.000 --> 00:12:36.640
and here's this very obvious
dyke walking through Soho

00:12:36.680 --> 00:12:39.080
with my shaved head
and my big boots.

00:12:42.760 --> 00:12:43.920
And suddenly, the same guys

00:12:43.960 --> 00:12:46.520
were giving me lots and lots of
money to see my body.

00:12:46.560 --> 00:12:47.680
It was kind of nuts.

00:12:53.880 --> 00:12:56.680
-Always had, like,
a legal and illegal part,

00:12:56.720 --> 00:12:58.120
and it was quite sleazy places.

00:12:58.160 --> 00:13:00.800
You did have to really
look out for yourself.

00:13:02.440 --> 00:13:05.400
-I would take my speed and
I'd share it with my friends

00:13:05.440 --> 00:13:08.880
and we'd go tramping round the
city centre of London at night.

00:13:08.920 --> 00:13:10.560
I felt like it was my city.

00:13:26.800 --> 00:13:28.480
Then there was that
whole twilight zone -

00:13:28.520 --> 00:13:30.600
literally the twilight zone -
where it was evening,

00:13:30.640 --> 00:13:32.720
you'd woken up, they were all
coming home from work,

00:13:32.760 --> 00:13:35.080
and that's when things happen.
That's when...

00:13:38.080 --> 00:13:40.600
Yeah, stuff happened
on the streets.

00:13:42.960 --> 00:13:44.800
The chances are, you probably
were gonna get

00:13:44.840 --> 00:13:46.560
your head slapped about.

00:13:46.600 --> 00:13:50.440
And so it was dangerous just to
be who you were in those days.

00:13:50.480 --> 00:13:52.560
MAJ: You didn't want to get
spotted on the streets.

00:13:53.960 --> 00:13:56.160
You would drop hands
at certain moments.

00:14:11.000 --> 00:14:15.520
At least two of my friends
were cut on their face,

00:14:15.560 --> 00:14:17.800
because they'd been
identified as dykes.

00:14:24.000 --> 00:14:26.040
So I ended up...
My mum was a nurse,

00:14:26.080 --> 00:14:28.560
so that qualified me to
do butterfly stitches,

00:14:28.600 --> 00:14:30.280
which I made out of...

00:14:30.320 --> 00:14:32.920
I don't know -
gaffer tape, probably -

00:14:32.960 --> 00:14:35.080
and fixed a scar on her face.

00:14:36.560 --> 00:14:39.520
YVONNE: I kind of, like,
was getting grief.

00:14:39.560 --> 00:14:41.200
Homophobia and racism.

00:14:43.080 --> 00:14:45.680
My first six months in London,

00:14:45.720 --> 00:14:48.240
I went to a few
political meetings.

00:14:50.360 --> 00:14:52.600
They had some sort of
conference

00:14:52.640 --> 00:14:55.040
at the South London Women's
Centre in Brixton,

00:14:55.080 --> 00:14:57.640
which I was invited to,
as a black woman.

00:14:57.680 --> 00:14:59.920
And when I got there
I was like,

00:14:59.960 --> 00:15:02.080
"Oh, God, this is so serious."

00:15:02.120 --> 00:15:04.560
A lot of discussion around
Greenham Common, for example.

00:15:04.600 --> 00:15:06.720
And I'd just come out
the army -

00:15:06.760 --> 00:15:09.040
do you think I was
mentioning that to anybody?

00:15:10.200 --> 00:15:12.880
Saturday night,
I'm not having a workshop

00:15:12.920 --> 00:15:14.080
and I'm not having a hug-in.

00:15:14.120 --> 00:15:16.080
I just want to cut some shapes
on the dance floor.

00:15:16.120 --> 00:15:17.920
I just want to go
and say "hi" to people.

00:15:17.960 --> 00:15:24.680
-There weren't that many places
for a young lesbian to go.

00:15:24.720 --> 00:15:27.240
When I came out about 1986,

00:15:27.280 --> 00:15:29.200
there was something like

00:15:29.240 --> 00:15:32.480
three or four bars or clubs
that I knew of.

00:15:32.520 --> 00:15:34.080
There was Gateways.

00:15:37.000 --> 00:15:40.640
And I think there was, like,
that Kenric Society for,

00:15:40.680 --> 00:15:43.600
you know, the rich women of
Kensington and Richmond

00:15:43.640 --> 00:15:46.400
which, obviously,
didn't apply to me.

00:15:47.880 --> 00:15:49.160
You'd get your dole on Thursday

00:15:49.200 --> 00:15:51.600
and you'd spent it by
Friday night.

00:15:51.640 --> 00:15:54.360
We made our own entertainment,
really.

00:15:54.400 --> 00:15:57.160
I used to DJ when I was in
the army, out of desperation.

00:15:59.480 --> 00:16:00.680
I knew a good party.

00:16:03.200 --> 00:16:05.760
We called it Sistermatic.

00:16:08.000 --> 00:16:09.880
And the club was run by four
black women -

00:16:09.920 --> 00:16:13.160
four very, very different black
women - and before we knew it,

00:16:13.200 --> 00:16:15.920
it'd kind of blown up into
this amazing party.

00:16:17.520 --> 00:16:19.440
We played a lot of lovers rock,

00:16:19.480 --> 00:16:22.760
reggae and dance-hall
sort of music.

00:16:27.560 --> 00:16:28.920
And we took it on a journey,

00:16:28.960 --> 00:16:31.560
so we played house music
in its early format.

00:16:31.600 --> 00:16:32.800
Well, I did.

00:16:32.840 --> 00:16:35.400
And, yeah, between
me and Lorna,

00:16:35.440 --> 00:16:37.960
who was one of the other DJs
in the collective,

00:16:38.000 --> 00:16:41.640
we could play from ten o'clock
till ten o'clock next morning.

00:16:44.760 --> 00:16:45.840
I started to see a rise

00:16:45.880 --> 00:16:47.880
in the number of Asian women
that would come.

00:16:47.920 --> 00:16:51.080
Lots of different younger
black women coming through.

00:16:51.120 --> 00:16:53.360
So, we had a whole
scope of people

00:16:53.400 --> 00:16:55.360
dancing to the same
sort of music.

00:16:55.400 --> 00:16:56.880
You had your, kind of,

00:16:56.920 --> 00:17:00.680
Greenham-Common-looking
feminist.

00:17:00.720 --> 00:17:04.880
You had your, kind of, S and M
dykes on bikes kind of thing.

00:17:06.040 --> 00:17:07.640
And there was quite a few
of them.

00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:10.200
MUSIC: Sister George
by Sister George

00:17:14.280 --> 00:17:16.720
Let's see those
Black Widows tattoos.

00:17:16.760 --> 00:17:18.440
LAUGHTER

00:17:19.520 --> 00:17:20.600
Hi!

00:17:36.000 --> 00:17:38.680
FISCH: The lesbian motorbike
group was the Black Widows.

00:17:41.080 --> 00:17:44.160
There was about - I don't
know - 20 of us, 30 of us.

00:17:45.640 --> 00:17:48.640
And, um, we used to go on runs.

00:17:50.160 --> 00:17:53.000
We've all got crash helmets,
so nobody can tell who we are.

00:17:53.040 --> 00:17:54.960
You know, and you see people
going, "Oh, my God!"

00:17:55.000 --> 00:17:56.480
Then we'd get off
our motorbikes,

00:17:56.520 --> 00:17:58.960
take off our crash helmets and
it's like... "Oh, it's women!

00:18:00.560 --> 00:18:01.720
"Let's go!"

00:18:04.520 --> 00:18:07.240
A lot of the motorbiking
lesbians I'd met

00:18:07.280 --> 00:18:10.000
used to go to the Bell so,
obviously, I went to the Bell.

00:18:14.760 --> 00:18:18.240
-The Bell was the only
truly mixed place

00:18:18.280 --> 00:18:19.960
for lesbians and gays,
you know.

00:18:20.000 --> 00:18:22.160
The Bell... I mean,
the Bell was crazy.

00:18:23.960 --> 00:18:26.040
Glue-sniffing. Drugs.

00:18:26.080 --> 00:18:27.400
Too much booze.

00:18:27.440 --> 00:18:28.480
Fights.

00:18:31.120 --> 00:18:33.440
There were skinheads there
but I...

00:18:33.480 --> 00:18:35.600
I think the thing was, cos I
had a Mohican at the time

00:18:35.640 --> 00:18:37.680
and I used to work out a lot,
I had a stance.

00:18:37.720 --> 00:18:39.160
You know, I had an attitude.

00:18:45.680 --> 00:18:48.040
And there were some beautiful
women there as well,

00:18:48.080 --> 00:18:50.880
so it was just like,
"What's not to like?"

00:18:50.920 --> 00:18:53.280
People like Sinead O'Connor
would go there

00:18:53.320 --> 00:18:56.160
and nick our style.
Yes, she did.

00:18:59.880 --> 00:19:02.280
TRILL: Wednesday night, it was
meant to be women's night.

00:19:02.320 --> 00:19:04.240
I remember the very first time
we went,

00:19:04.280 --> 00:19:06.120
it was completely dead.

00:19:06.160 --> 00:19:08.320
The music was just
bland and awful.

00:19:11.000 --> 00:19:12.840
So we thought, "We can do
better than this -

00:19:12.880 --> 00:19:15.520
"let's try and get a night here
and get some second-hand vinyl

00:19:15.560 --> 00:19:17.720
"and, you know, be creative."

00:19:19.840 --> 00:19:22.720
The Sleeze Sisters,
the monumental Sleeze Sisters,

00:19:22.760 --> 00:19:24.720
Trill and Pom.

00:19:24.760 --> 00:19:27.160
They played everything that
I wanted to hear.

00:19:36.440 --> 00:19:40.920
One of the first serious bands
I was in, Mouth Almighty,

00:19:40.960 --> 00:19:43.120
one of our first gigs
was actually at the Bell.

00:19:43.160 --> 00:19:46.480
There were loads of
lesbian bands on the scene.

00:19:46.520 --> 00:19:49.160
How could I could I forget
the Brixton legends that were

00:19:49.200 --> 00:19:50.600
the Sluts from Outer Space?

00:19:50.640 --> 00:19:53.480
MUSIC: Queer Riot by
Sluts from Outer Space

00:19:54.600 --> 00:19:57.080
"Dykes get a lot of trouble
cos we don't suck their dicks.

00:19:57.120 --> 00:19:59.640
"Why don't we get together
and throw some fucking bricks?"

00:20:02.360 --> 00:20:05.400
♪ Dykes get a lot of trouble
cos we don't suck their dicks

00:20:05.440 --> 00:20:08.400
♪ Why don't we get together and
throw some fucking bricks? ♪

00:20:08.440 --> 00:20:11.280
A - you couldn't be a woman
in a band.

00:20:11.320 --> 00:20:13.800
B - you couldn't be
a women-only band.

00:20:13.840 --> 00:20:15.680
C - you couldn't be lesbians.

00:20:15.720 --> 00:20:19.400
So, you know, on all commercial
fronts, we were fucked.

00:20:19.440 --> 00:20:20.880
But we didn't care -
we just did it.

00:20:20.920 --> 00:20:22.800
♪ Queer riot

00:20:22.840 --> 00:20:23.960
♪ We want a riot

00:20:24.000 --> 00:20:25.360
♪ Queer riot

00:20:25.400 --> 00:20:26.840
♪ Want a riot of our own. ♪

00:20:29.800 --> 00:20:33.880
That's the first time I came
to London, just to find a band.

00:20:35.040 --> 00:20:37.520
We got to organise this big
concert

00:20:37.560 --> 00:20:41.200
in the Fabrik in Hamburg,
which is this big music venue.

00:20:42.320 --> 00:20:44.040
They said,
"This doesn't actually exist.

00:20:44.080 --> 00:20:46.120
"There aren't women bands
to play there."

00:20:46.160 --> 00:20:47.440
And I said,
"You must be joking.

00:20:47.480 --> 00:20:49.800
"We will find them, bring them
here and they will play."

00:20:52.760 --> 00:20:55.720
So, I came in December 1986.

00:21:02.000 --> 00:21:03.800
I mean, on this Monday evening

00:21:03.840 --> 00:21:07.760
is kind of when my life
really totally changed.

00:21:07.800 --> 00:21:09.360
It was... It was amazing.

00:21:09.400 --> 00:21:13.040
I met these Finnish women
that were visiting.

00:21:13.080 --> 00:21:15.200
Seija was telling me
she wanted to start

00:21:15.240 --> 00:21:17.480
this women's S and M club
in London.

00:21:17.520 --> 00:21:20.360
I was really
fascinated with the idea

00:21:20.400 --> 00:21:22.960
and I was also very fascinated
with Seija, I have to admit.

00:21:23.000 --> 00:21:24.720
She was very gorgeous-looking.

00:21:24.760 --> 00:21:28.160
Tall. They were wearing
this uniform - caps,

00:21:28.200 --> 00:21:31.800
these long military coats,
big boots and very...

00:21:31.840 --> 00:21:35.000
She was very passionate about
her ideas and I loved that.

00:21:37.280 --> 00:21:41.160
We had already been running
a club called Extasy in Finland

00:21:41.200 --> 00:21:45.080
since 1985, doing
the kind of things

00:21:45.120 --> 00:21:48.240
with arts, pornography and SM.

00:21:48.280 --> 00:21:51.040
And we always mixed those
three things together.

00:21:54.760 --> 00:21:58.800
There were lots of trans people
there and lesbian mothers

00:21:58.840 --> 00:22:01.280
and there were bisexuals
and androgynous people,

00:22:01.320 --> 00:22:02.840
like how we called ourselves.

00:22:02.880 --> 00:22:06.400
It was kind of, like, a really
open queer group

00:22:06.440 --> 00:22:08.840
and it attracted people who
were artist-minded

00:22:08.880 --> 00:22:12.160
and who were really free.
Free in their will.

00:22:12.200 --> 00:22:15.440
BAYA: She was an artist
but she wanted to also

00:22:15.480 --> 00:22:18.560
bring sex into art
or art into sex.

00:22:18.600 --> 00:22:21.360
MUSIC: Primal Bond
by Tapanda Re

00:22:51.800 --> 00:22:54.800
Chain Reaction had had a real
build-up

00:22:54.840 --> 00:22:56.760
from women all over the place.
Some were saying,

00:22:56.800 --> 00:22:58.320
"Oh, no, you don't want to
go there.

00:22:58.360 --> 00:23:00.320
"Don't... You know...
Dodgy lot of women."

00:23:08.680 --> 00:23:10.080
And then other women saying,

00:23:10.120 --> 00:23:12.680
"Oh!" You know, "You've got
to go, you've got to go."

00:23:16.000 --> 00:23:18.400
FISCH: I knew you had to wear
a dress code

00:23:18.440 --> 00:23:22.120
and I had a leather jacket

00:23:22.160 --> 00:23:23.640
and I had Dr Marten boots.

00:23:23.680 --> 00:23:25.480
So I thought, "Oh, that'll do."

00:23:25.520 --> 00:23:28.880
So I went and, you know, I paid
my pound and I got in

00:23:28.920 --> 00:23:32.120
and I was just so scared of
meeting anybody

00:23:32.160 --> 00:23:33.720
and I thought it was
gonna be...

00:23:33.760 --> 00:23:35.800
You know, I didn't really have
an understanding

00:23:35.840 --> 00:23:37.200
of what happened there.

00:23:41.160 --> 00:23:43.960
We would arrive
at about nine o'clock.

00:23:44.000 --> 00:23:46.240
I think we opened about ten.

00:23:46.280 --> 00:23:49.120
And we would
have our tool of choice,

00:23:49.160 --> 00:23:51.560
which was a roll of black
bin liners, and then we would

00:23:51.600 --> 00:23:54.240
cover up all the windows
with black bin liners.

00:23:54.280 --> 00:23:55.720
That was all the decorating
we did,

00:23:55.760 --> 00:23:58.200
was just covering
up the windows.

00:23:58.240 --> 00:24:00.520
There was a back room, where...
That was almost like

00:24:00.560 --> 00:24:02.800
a culture of its own, actually,
the pool room.

00:24:02.840 --> 00:24:04.880
Sometimes you'd wander in with
your rubber dress,

00:24:04.920 --> 00:24:06.840
trying to
attract a butch's attention.

00:24:06.880 --> 00:24:08.960
-Everybody was very busy,
of course, coming there

00:24:09.000 --> 00:24:10.800
and looking very cool
in their leathers,

00:24:10.840 --> 00:24:12.960
and finding people to
have sex with.

00:24:13.000 --> 00:24:15.440
But the cabaret was
a bit like the highlight.

00:24:24.040 --> 00:24:26.560
I had seen maybe one
Monty Python film

00:24:26.600 --> 00:24:29.160
and when I saw the first
cabaret at Chain Reaction,

00:24:29.200 --> 00:24:30.840
that's what it reminded me of.

00:24:32.360 --> 00:24:35.960
It was so bad it was good.

00:24:46.760 --> 00:24:50.800
We had things like mud
wrestling - yes, I did that.

00:24:54.200 --> 00:24:56.280
THEY YELL

00:24:58.040 --> 00:24:59.640
CHEERING

00:25:01.640 --> 00:25:04.440
Baby-oil wrestling -
yes, I did that.

00:25:14.120 --> 00:25:17.320
Spaghetti-hoop wrestling -
no, I didn't do that.

00:25:17.360 --> 00:25:20.440
Spaghetti, which we haven't
actually forgiven Baya for.

00:25:21.840 --> 00:25:23.800
-Spaghetti?
-Spaghetti.

00:25:25.920 --> 00:25:27.400
BAYA: I could just really fancy

00:25:27.440 --> 00:25:29.960
having ketchup
poured all over me

00:25:30.000 --> 00:25:31.520
and have it, sort of,
run over me.

00:25:31.560 --> 00:25:33.480
I thought that'd be
quite theatrical.

00:25:39.000 --> 00:25:43.000
-I got to be the person who did
a lot of the cabarets,

00:25:43.040 --> 00:25:46.600
because I was quite excited
about getting fucked in public.

00:25:47.800 --> 00:25:49.560
My name, in those days,
was Jane Campbell,

00:25:49.600 --> 00:25:53.120
and I was known as
Jane, Jane, Queen of Pain.

00:25:57.000 --> 00:26:00.080
When I was a kid, I had
behavioural stuff

00:26:00.120 --> 00:26:01.360
about attention seeking.

00:26:01.400 --> 00:26:03.760
They used to call it
attention-seeking behaviour.

00:26:03.800 --> 00:26:06.000
And, you know, I was actually
quite a lonely kid.

00:26:06.040 --> 00:26:08.160
But anyway, it developed into
a kind of sexuality,

00:26:08.200 --> 00:26:11.880
and I was very ashamed of
wanting sex all the time.

00:26:11.920 --> 00:26:15.800
You know, that slut-shaming
thing that goes on about,

00:26:15.840 --> 00:26:18.520
if you love sex there's
something wrong with you.

00:26:18.560 --> 00:26:20.840
And, yeah, I just got loved
and all my friends

00:26:20.880 --> 00:26:23.520
were really accepting of it
and indulgent of it,

00:26:23.560 --> 00:26:25.120
and I learned to
love it myself.

00:26:25.160 --> 00:26:26.440
Love that part of myself.

00:26:29.440 --> 00:26:32.640
I was crucified to a cross,

00:26:32.680 --> 00:26:35.840
er, tied to a motorbike, er...

00:26:54.600 --> 00:26:57.040
It was just thrilling.
My eyes popped.

00:27:10.760 --> 00:27:13.600
A lot in leather.
Just really sharp-looking.

00:27:13.640 --> 00:27:16.120
You were allowed to be
butch and femme,

00:27:16.160 --> 00:27:18.840
but not in the old-fashioned
'50s way,

00:27:18.880 --> 00:27:21.480
which is kind of the image
we had behind us.

00:27:24.440 --> 00:27:27.200
Depends how far we go back
but there was that whole...

00:27:27.240 --> 00:27:30.040
pre-Chain Reaction thing which
was really, kind of,

00:27:30.080 --> 00:27:32.200
about butch and femme
and looking like

00:27:32.240 --> 00:27:34.200
a straight man and
a straight woman.

00:27:34.240 --> 00:27:36.520
Because if you were
able to pull that off,

00:27:36.560 --> 00:27:39.960
you could walk past a homophobe
and they wouldn't clock you.

00:27:40.000 --> 00:27:42.120
So what that was the idea
behind butch and femme.

00:27:42.160 --> 00:27:45.200
Especially if you wanted to be
a bit tarty,

00:27:45.240 --> 00:27:48.440
you were better off with
a really, really butch woman,

00:27:48.480 --> 00:27:50.800
because then you really did
pass for straight.

00:27:53.320 --> 00:27:55.800
I could wear lipstick
and I could be girlie.

00:27:58.880 --> 00:28:00.120
I could wear heels

00:28:00.160 --> 00:28:01.760
but I wasn't buying into

00:28:01.800 --> 00:28:03.960
the straight world at all.

00:28:04.000 --> 00:28:05.920
Which I would never have done.

00:28:05.960 --> 00:28:08.600
So, yeah, it felt like
a freeing.

00:28:14.000 --> 00:28:16.760
DEL: There were very few
safe spaces.

00:28:16.800 --> 00:28:18.520
And at Chain Reaction,

00:28:18.560 --> 00:28:22.240
it was a space for femme dykes
to be femme.

00:28:24.560 --> 00:28:26.320
Another thing about
Chain Reaction

00:28:26.360 --> 00:28:29.520
which was very different for
lesbian clubs of the time

00:28:29.560 --> 00:28:31.560
was that it was
trans-inclusive.

00:28:31.600 --> 00:28:34.360
Little did I know that,
you know,

00:28:34.400 --> 00:28:37.000
some years later I
would identify

00:28:37.040 --> 00:28:39.440
as both trans and intersex.

00:28:40.680 --> 00:28:42.920
ROZ: I mean, this was the '80s.

00:28:44.360 --> 00:28:48.200
Trans people
identified as lesbian or bi,

00:28:48.240 --> 00:28:52.280
tended to be very
deeply in the closet about it -

00:28:52.320 --> 00:28:56.040
both because of
getting access to surgery

00:28:56.080 --> 00:28:58.600
and drugs from the
gatekeeping doctors,

00:28:58.640 --> 00:29:01.240
and because people were
led to believe

00:29:01.280 --> 00:29:03.240
it was unacceptable
on the scene.

00:29:04.680 --> 00:29:07.560
Compared with every other
lesbian scene in London,

00:29:07.600 --> 00:29:11.000
Chain Reaction was
comparatively accepting

00:29:11.040 --> 00:29:12.200
of trans women.

00:29:15.000 --> 00:29:18.400
The same month that
I actually transitioned,

00:29:18.440 --> 00:29:20.680
The Transsexual Empire was
published in London,

00:29:27.720 --> 00:29:31.720
in which Janice Raymone said,
quote:

00:29:31.760 --> 00:29:39.000
"The transsexual constructed
lesbian Feminist violates
women's sexuality and spirit."

00:29:41.000 --> 00:29:43.000
So, having a place to go

00:29:43.040 --> 00:29:47.080
where being trans wasn't...

00:29:47.120 --> 00:29:49.040
an absolute no-no...

00:29:51.000 --> 00:29:52.200
..was very, very cool.

00:29:53.520 --> 00:29:56.440
Chain Reaction - I don't know
how long it lasted, but...

00:29:56.480 --> 00:29:59.520
maybe it was only a couple of
years or so. But it really...

00:29:59.560 --> 00:30:02.240
It really created an incredible
bond between us.

00:30:02.280 --> 00:30:04.520
We hung out together...

00:30:04.560 --> 00:30:05.920
in a big house.

00:30:05.960 --> 00:30:07.960
MUSIC: Soray by
Tapanda Re

00:30:11.920 --> 00:30:15.200
LULU: There were three houses
of lesbians,

00:30:15.240 --> 00:30:18.160
all, you know, like,
almost in a row.

00:30:18.200 --> 00:30:21.760
-There were just lesbians
stuffed into every room.

00:30:21.800 --> 00:30:24.480
There was, like, I don't know,
maybe about six rooms

00:30:24.520 --> 00:30:26.680
but there'd be
18 people living there.

00:30:32.520 --> 00:30:34.960
There'd always be a menagerie
of animals.

00:30:35.000 --> 00:30:38.120
Rats, terrapins, dogs -

00:30:38.160 --> 00:30:39.640
everything.

00:30:39.680 --> 00:30:41.400
Cats, obviously.

00:30:50.440 --> 00:30:54.120
It was a real creative time.
I mean, everybody was...

00:30:54.160 --> 00:30:56.160
You know, people were either
taking photographs

00:30:56.200 --> 00:31:00.640
or, you know, writing or
making art or doing theatre.

00:31:02.040 --> 00:31:04.760
The scene was...different.

00:31:04.800 --> 00:31:06.520
It was a lot more intimate.

00:31:07.600 --> 00:31:09.600
DEL: Everybody sleeping
with everybody else.

00:31:09.640 --> 00:31:11.040
FISCH: That thing in
The L Word,

00:31:11.080 --> 00:31:13.120
where they've got that big
chart at the beginning -

00:31:13.160 --> 00:31:15.880
they nicked that off us.
That was our idea.

00:31:15.920 --> 00:31:18.080
It was like a lesbian soap.

00:31:18.120 --> 00:31:20.600
And there was one woman on
there who was incredibly cute

00:31:20.640 --> 00:31:23.240
and she pretty much slept with
everybody,

00:31:23.280 --> 00:31:26.520
and so they make this big chart
with her name in the middle

00:31:26.560 --> 00:31:28.600
and then, like,
arrows going off

00:31:28.640 --> 00:31:30.160
to all the people
she'd slept with

00:31:30.200 --> 00:31:32.920
and then all the people
they'd slept with.

00:31:32.960 --> 00:31:35.000
We loved each other and
then we loved people

00:31:35.040 --> 00:31:36.560
who loved our lovers,

00:31:36.600 --> 00:31:39.000
so why wouldn't we want to
shag them as well, then?

00:31:42.000 --> 00:31:45.640
DEL: Jane and I had exactly
the same taste in butchness.

00:31:45.680 --> 00:31:48.800
So, really, I had great fun
for years

00:31:48.840 --> 00:31:51.880
playing "nab that butch".

00:31:51.920 --> 00:31:54.320
You know, Jane would see,
and if Jane saw me

00:31:54.360 --> 00:31:56.880
being interested
in somebody, you know,

00:31:56.920 --> 00:32:01.320
we had a real fierce
friendly competition.

00:32:03.200 --> 00:32:04.760
She usually won.

00:32:04.800 --> 00:32:06.440
We loved each other.

00:32:06.480 --> 00:32:08.200
It was one big happy
shaggy family.

00:32:11.680 --> 00:32:13.840
BAYA: Originally, I come
from East Germany.

00:32:13.880 --> 00:32:16.560
When I was 17, my family
escaped to West Germany.

00:32:16.600 --> 00:32:18.840
My father, he had real problems
in East Germany.

00:32:18.880 --> 00:32:21.480
He was put in prison as
a political prisoner

00:32:21.520 --> 00:32:22.840
for two and a half years.

00:32:22.880 --> 00:32:24.040
I knew if I stayed on my own,

00:32:24.080 --> 00:32:26.640
I would have a lot of
repercussions of them escaping.

00:32:28.360 --> 00:32:30.360
I found it really difficult to
fit in in the West

00:32:30.400 --> 00:32:31.880
and I had quite a...

00:32:31.920 --> 00:32:34.320
My parents left and lived
somewhere else.

00:32:34.360 --> 00:32:36.560
I was on my own,
and feeling quite lonely.

00:32:36.600 --> 00:32:39.680
When I came to London,
I was single for quite a while.

00:32:39.720 --> 00:32:42.440
What really saved me
was the women that I met

00:32:42.480 --> 00:32:44.280
and who I made friends with.

00:32:44.320 --> 00:32:45.880
That became my family.

00:32:45.920 --> 00:32:47.680
That was something that
was lasting.

00:32:47.720 --> 00:32:49.520
There were people...

00:32:49.560 --> 00:32:52.040
that loved me and that I loved.

00:33:11.000 --> 00:33:14.400
-Our birth families had
rejected us, basically.

00:33:14.440 --> 00:33:16.920
So we would get
together at Christmas...

00:33:20.360 --> 00:33:22.600
This one Christmas, I think we
had 26 women

00:33:22.640 --> 00:33:23.760
for Christmas dinner.

00:33:29.400 --> 00:33:31.320
BAYA: So, we'd wake up
in the morning,

00:33:31.360 --> 00:33:33.680
everybody would be in jimjams
and we'd have Bucks fizz.

00:33:39.440 --> 00:33:42.080
-I think we all got drunk
before 11 o'clock.

00:33:44.160 --> 00:33:47.520
-Mountains of presents that we
all just gave each other.

00:33:47.560 --> 00:33:49.520
We spent all day just
unwrapping presents

00:33:49.560 --> 00:33:52.200
and, of course,
we'd have to have a turkey.

00:33:52.240 --> 00:33:55.800
Baya fisted the turkey
and everyone watched.

00:33:55.840 --> 00:33:57.000
Had this enormous turkey.

00:33:57.040 --> 00:33:59.240
It was so big, it wouldn't
fit in our tiny little oven.

00:33:59.280 --> 00:34:01.800
Probably had taken some acid
in the afternoon

00:34:01.840 --> 00:34:03.800
to go with the buck's fizz.
And then about eight

00:34:03.840 --> 00:34:05.640
in the evening, everyone
went, "Oh, my God -

00:34:05.680 --> 00:34:08.480
"we've got a turkey.
We need to put it in the oven."

00:34:08.520 --> 00:34:10.840
So I started, you know,
mixing the apples,

00:34:10.880 --> 00:34:12.760
onions, breadcrumbs, stuffing.

00:34:15.520 --> 00:34:19.000
As I was stuffing the turkey,
I just so tripped out.

00:34:24.040 --> 00:34:26.240
As if I was in
a different galaxy,

00:34:26.280 --> 00:34:27.640
where having sex with a turkey

00:34:27.680 --> 00:34:30.360
was a perfectly fine thing
to do. It was weird.

00:34:35.920 --> 00:34:38.920
MUSIC: Wrapped Up In Sex
by Mouth Almighty

00:34:45.320 --> 00:34:49.960
SEIJA: It was like our little
own fantasy world.

00:34:50.000 --> 00:34:52.400
♪ I have got

00:34:52.440 --> 00:34:54.440
♪ No, no, no regrets

00:34:56.320 --> 00:34:57.680
♪ I don't need

00:34:58.920 --> 00:35:00.280
♪ A permanent lover... ♪

00:35:02.920 --> 00:35:06.440
We were decorating only
with black plastic, you know,

00:35:06.480 --> 00:35:09.360
and all black stuff.
So I had this idea that tonight

00:35:09.400 --> 00:35:11.480
I'd do something really
nice and soft

00:35:11.520 --> 00:35:14.600
and I went to Waterloo
flower market in the morning

00:35:14.640 --> 00:35:16.920
to pick up flowers that had
been left on the floor.

00:35:16.960 --> 00:35:19.120
And we had a huge amount of
flowers

00:35:19.160 --> 00:35:22.080
and we took them to the club
and we were putting them up

00:35:22.120 --> 00:35:24.760
everywhere, when we heard
a knock on the door.

00:35:26.840 --> 00:35:28.440
They were all covered
in the face -

00:35:28.480 --> 00:35:29.840
we couldn't recognise them.

00:35:29.880 --> 00:35:32.440
With sticks and bars and shit.

00:35:32.480 --> 00:35:34.560
And they had crowbars and axes.

00:35:34.600 --> 00:35:36.000
Mashing up the bar,

00:35:36.040 --> 00:35:39.440
hitting some of the women
who were there,

00:35:39.480 --> 00:35:42.320
and just screeching about
violence against women.

00:35:42.360 --> 00:35:45.400
And, finally,
the woman behind the bar,

00:35:45.440 --> 00:35:47.640
she started screaming
out really loud.

00:35:51.000 --> 00:35:53.680
It was an organisation called
Wavaw.

00:35:53.720 --> 00:35:57.240
Women Against Violence
Against Women.

00:35:57.280 --> 00:35:59.800
It was a group called Women
Against Women

00:35:59.840 --> 00:36:02.360
Who Are Into Sadomasochism.

00:36:02.400 --> 00:36:03.640
It was like, er,

00:36:03.680 --> 00:36:06.640
Lesbians Against Violence
Against Women

00:36:06.680 --> 00:36:08.160
standing outside.

00:36:08.200 --> 00:36:11.040
And they would
sit outside the club

00:36:11.080 --> 00:36:13.600
and hiss to everybody
who came in.

00:36:13.640 --> 00:36:16.040
MUSIC: Life - No
by the Petticoats

00:36:26.080 --> 00:36:29.200
♪ All those people
in the dole queues

00:36:29.240 --> 00:36:30.920
♪ All those businessmen
in the... ♪

00:36:30.960 --> 00:36:32.480
I was brought up as
a socialist -

00:36:32.520 --> 00:36:34.200
I was never to
cross a picket line.

00:36:34.240 --> 00:36:36.200
I had to cross
my first picket line

00:36:36.240 --> 00:36:38.640
because they were trying to
stop us from going in.

00:36:40.440 --> 00:36:42.320
And I knew some of those women.

00:36:46.000 --> 00:36:49.000
So, the women that I took
to Greenham

00:36:49.040 --> 00:36:51.560
ended up being
some of the women

00:36:51.600 --> 00:36:54.080
that picketed Chain Reaction
on the first night.

00:36:59.200 --> 00:37:01.400
One of my performances did get
stormed, actually,

00:37:01.440 --> 00:37:02.600
by some of those women.

00:37:05.440 --> 00:37:07.040
I had my friend
in the audience,

00:37:07.080 --> 00:37:09.160
who came and volunteered.

00:37:09.200 --> 00:37:12.400
She had to pick things out of
a bag and I would say,

00:37:12.440 --> 00:37:14.320
"How would you like me
to use this you?"

00:37:14.360 --> 00:37:17.480
But she was blindfolded, you
know, and had to touch things,

00:37:17.520 --> 00:37:21.600
and ended up with her
on all fours, tied up,

00:37:21.640 --> 00:37:27.400
and hot wax started and it
just went absolutely crazy.

00:37:27.440 --> 00:37:30.280
Because a whole load of women
stormed the stage,

00:37:30.320 --> 00:37:32.440
trying to beat us up.

00:37:32.480 --> 00:37:34.640
They didn't realise it was
a whole set-up - that it was

00:37:34.680 --> 00:37:37.280
playing with this idea of,
how far can you push things?

00:37:37.320 --> 00:37:41.120
And almost putting a mirror up
to oneself and others.

00:37:42.720 --> 00:37:45.200
Then there was a huge debate,
with some of the other women

00:37:45.240 --> 00:37:47.440
saying, "What the hell are you
doing? You can't go and

00:37:47.480 --> 00:37:49.960
"attack women for this. You
don't know even the context."

00:38:01.560 --> 00:38:04.240
I understood that they
perceived SM

00:38:04.280 --> 00:38:08.720
as aping or copying domestic
violence relationships.

00:38:08.760 --> 00:38:10.760
SEIJA: That there is blood in
your hands

00:38:10.800 --> 00:38:13.360
and there's a man in your head
and you're violent.

00:38:16.520 --> 00:38:21.400
When we were beating each other
and cutting each other,

00:38:21.440 --> 00:38:24.160
it took the power away
from that thing.

00:38:24.200 --> 00:38:27.080
Somehow we felt much more like
we could survive a beating.

00:38:32.560 --> 00:38:34.480
Even though I knew a lot of
these women

00:38:34.520 --> 00:38:36.880
were sweeties underneath,
very often there was

00:38:36.920 --> 00:38:39.600
a kind of callousness
displayed.

00:38:47.440 --> 00:38:50.280
DEL: I had ideological
political differences

00:38:50.320 --> 00:38:53.240
with some of the women
in Chain Reaction

00:38:53.280 --> 00:38:55.880
who wanted to enact
Nazi fantasies

00:38:55.920 --> 00:38:58.600
or wear Nazi uniforms
to the club.

00:38:58.640 --> 00:39:02.480
And that was the line
you do not cross.

00:39:02.520 --> 00:39:04.040
I did not want to be part
of that

00:39:04.080 --> 00:39:07.080
and I argued fiercely
against it and I won.

00:39:07.120 --> 00:39:09.360
TYPEWRITERS CLACK

00:39:11.280 --> 00:39:15.080
We got denounced in the London
Women's Liberation newsletter,

00:39:15.120 --> 00:39:19.240
for wearing instruments of
torture and Nazi regalia,

00:39:19.280 --> 00:39:21.160
which was, like,
a little over the top.

00:39:21.200 --> 00:39:23.920
Never worn a swastika in my
life, shout at people who do.

00:39:23.960 --> 00:39:25.440
But, you know, we got
denounced

00:39:25.480 --> 00:39:29.320
for wearing a Muir cap
and a biker jacket.

00:39:29.360 --> 00:39:33.200
A hugely political thing,
wearing a leather jacket,

00:39:33.240 --> 00:39:35.200
as a lesbian.

00:39:35.240 --> 00:39:36.920
You were a Nazi if you did.

00:39:36.960 --> 00:39:39.720
MUSIC: Rococo Subversive
by Sister George

00:39:52.000 --> 00:39:54.160
CHANTING

00:39:59.840 --> 00:40:01.640
CHEERING

00:40:08.320 --> 00:40:10.440
We at Chain Reaction,
on the contrary,

00:40:10.480 --> 00:40:13.400
work towards a mutual and equal
power exchange

00:40:13.440 --> 00:40:15.920
based on the
principle of consent.

00:40:15.960 --> 00:40:18.840
Lesbian S and M is a woman's
right to say "no"

00:40:18.880 --> 00:40:20.920
and her choice to say "yes".

00:40:20.960 --> 00:40:25.120
DEBBIE: There was a great big
talk about the lesbian scene

00:40:25.160 --> 00:40:28.480
and sexuality,
and we went down -

00:40:28.520 --> 00:40:30.800
the Bell dykes and
the Chain Reaction dykes -

00:40:30.840 --> 00:40:33.160
in our leather and Muir caps

00:40:33.200 --> 00:40:36.200
and, you know, chains
and what have you,

00:40:36.240 --> 00:40:40.120
and sat there clanking
away in the seats,

00:40:40.160 --> 00:40:44.720
listening to people talking
about how wrong S and M was.

00:40:46.000 --> 00:40:48.080
ANDERSON: Despite attempts at
sexual repression,

00:40:48.120 --> 00:40:50.760
both within and outside
the gay community,

00:40:50.800 --> 00:40:53.400
Chain Reaction continues
to be successful

00:40:53.440 --> 00:40:56.040
because we encourage women to
explore their sexual fantasies,

00:40:56.080 --> 00:40:59.400
to be themselves and to make
each other feel good.

00:40:59.440 --> 00:41:01.240
We work to create an atmosphere

00:41:01.280 --> 00:41:03.320
that is safe and
non-judgemental.

00:41:06.960 --> 00:41:08.040
Everybody had completely

00:41:08.080 --> 00:41:09.720
lost their sense of humour
by this time.

00:41:15.000 --> 00:41:17.400
Lesbian dykes are being told
that they're fascist

00:41:17.440 --> 00:41:19.840
and they're perverted
and they're male oriented.

00:41:19.880 --> 00:41:21.520
I mean, that's
what needs to stop

00:41:21.560 --> 00:41:23.880
and I think that's what
we need to talk about.

00:41:25.200 --> 00:41:27.240
Linda Bellos, I think it was,

00:41:27.280 --> 00:41:33.240
said that if she saw a black
woman with handcuffs on

00:41:33.280 --> 00:41:36.440
it reminded her of slavery and
she thought that they were

00:41:36.480 --> 00:41:39.400
diminishing themselves
and their ancestors.

00:41:39.440 --> 00:41:42.040
And at that point, I was,
sort of,

00:41:42.080 --> 00:41:44.960
getting nudged by people
sitting next to me,

00:41:45.000 --> 00:41:47.560
and I stood up and I was like,
"Well, I'm black

00:41:47.600 --> 00:41:50.800
"and I wear a leather jacket
and I've got chains, so..."

00:41:50.840 --> 00:41:52.640
And then I sat down again.

00:41:52.680 --> 00:41:54.080
So, that was my...

00:41:54.120 --> 00:41:57.680
My immense contribution
to the conversation.

00:41:57.720 --> 00:42:00.800
But, you know, I think even
just that little thing

00:42:00.840 --> 00:42:04.560
did actually make a bit of
a difference because,

00:42:04.600 --> 00:42:07.120
you know, it just showed
that you can't generalise

00:42:07.160 --> 00:42:09.320
and you can't say that

00:42:09.360 --> 00:42:12.560
what I believe has to be
what you believe.

00:42:12.600 --> 00:42:15.480
As far as I know, my experience
of women involved

00:42:15.520 --> 00:42:16.920
or defining themselves
as S and M

00:42:16.960 --> 00:42:19.240
or interested in exploring
role-play and sexuality

00:42:19.280 --> 00:42:21.480
in general, are absolutely
anti-racist,

00:42:21.520 --> 00:42:25.200
anti-sexist, anti-fascist
and...

00:42:26.240 --> 00:42:27.960
What we're doing, basically,

00:42:28.000 --> 00:42:31.600
is trying to play with
all these symbols -

00:42:31.640 --> 00:42:34.400
and they are symbols, and they
are very powerful symbols -

00:42:34.440 --> 00:42:36.440
of oppression and violence,

00:42:36.480 --> 00:42:39.360
as opposed to being, ourselves,
oppressive and violent.

00:42:39.400 --> 00:42:41.360
It's not "anybody can do
anything to anybody

00:42:41.400 --> 00:42:43.640
"whenever they like,
whether it's violent or not".

00:42:43.680 --> 00:42:46.440
It's not about that.
It's a very structured thing.

00:42:46.480 --> 00:42:49.040
There are certain rules
within that anarchy.

00:42:50.120 --> 00:42:53.640
The issues about S and M
and lesbians really arose

00:42:53.680 --> 00:42:57.080
because of arguments
within feminism.

00:42:57.120 --> 00:43:00.240
And those happened
right from the '70s upwards.

00:43:02.240 --> 00:43:04.360
When I came out
in the mid-'70s,

00:43:04.400 --> 00:43:06.400
I felt like I was a bit of
a second-class lesbian,

00:43:06.440 --> 00:43:09.120
cos I was a lesbian out of lust
and not out of politics.

00:43:11.080 --> 00:43:12.640
I have quite a lot of
vanilla sex.

00:43:12.680 --> 00:43:14.200
-What is vanilla sex?
-Um...

00:43:14.240 --> 00:43:15.800
-What is it?
-What is it?

00:43:15.840 --> 00:43:17.880
Well... I don't know. Maybe you
should define what

00:43:17.920 --> 00:43:20.040
vanilla sex is, cos you say
you're a hot vanilla dyke.

00:43:20.080 --> 00:43:22.280
I think it's fantastic that
you're a hot vanilla dyke.

00:43:22.320 --> 00:43:24.120
..a lovely ice cream or a...

00:43:24.160 --> 00:43:25.680
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

00:43:25.720 --> 00:43:27.440
I just wanna say
one other thing...

00:43:29.520 --> 00:43:32.400
CHATTER DROWNS SPEAKER

00:43:32.440 --> 00:43:33.600
..attack.

00:43:33.640 --> 00:43:35.440
No, I don't.
I just said to you...

00:43:35.480 --> 00:43:37.520
Can we listen to
what's being said?

00:43:41.200 --> 00:43:44.160
That's basically what the whole
lesbian scene was

00:43:44.200 --> 00:43:46.280
around the '80s. It was a...

00:43:46.320 --> 00:43:50.440
hugely homogenised
view of lesbian society,

00:43:50.480 --> 00:43:54.440
in which you had to be wearing
pastel colours and dungarees

00:43:54.480 --> 00:43:58.680
and going to Greenham
and wear Birkenstocks.

00:43:58.720 --> 00:44:01.040
And we did not want to do that.

00:44:01.080 --> 00:44:03.360
That's why we were
the rebel dykes, you know.

00:44:03.400 --> 00:44:05.440
We wanted to do what
we wanted to do.

00:44:05.480 --> 00:44:07.360
We came out of punk.

00:44:07.400 --> 00:44:10.920
You know, we came out of
art school. We were musicians.

00:44:10.960 --> 00:44:12.680
We were artists.

00:44:12.720 --> 00:44:15.000
We didn't want to do,
necessarily,

00:44:15.040 --> 00:44:17.440
what everyone else
wanted to do.

00:44:17.480 --> 00:44:19.400
You don't look
like a bunch of dykes -

00:44:19.440 --> 00:44:21.240
you look like a bunch of
poofs.

00:44:21.280 --> 00:44:23.760
CHEERING

00:44:23.800 --> 00:44:26.960
That kind of
"every woman can be a lesbian",

00:44:27.000 --> 00:44:29.280
which started as
a political theory,

00:44:29.320 --> 00:44:31.840
ended up as a kind of rule
of thumb, and then we started

00:44:31.880 --> 00:44:34.160
making more and more rules
for ourselves

00:44:34.200 --> 00:44:37.360
about what you had to do
to be a proper lesbian.

00:44:37.400 --> 00:44:39.040
And there started to be all
these rules

00:44:39.080 --> 00:44:41.000
about what you did
and didn't do in bed.

00:44:41.040 --> 00:44:44.400
Penetrative sex was wrong,
and any kind of

00:44:44.440 --> 00:44:47.160
dominance and submission games
were wrong.

00:44:47.200 --> 00:44:49.240
Any kind of role-playing
was wrong.

00:44:49.280 --> 00:44:52.440
And that's where the hatred of
SM dykes

00:44:52.480 --> 00:44:56.000
by the mainstream lesbian
feminist movement came from

00:44:56.040 --> 00:44:57.720
and it was never the twain
shall meet.

00:44:57.760 --> 00:45:00.920
And it came out of really
genuine concerns in things

00:45:00.960 --> 00:45:03.800
like Women's Aid and stuff like
that about male violence

00:45:03.840 --> 00:45:05.560
but it got transmogrified into,

00:45:05.600 --> 00:45:07.560
essentially,
the lesbian sex police.

00:45:10.920 --> 00:45:12.920
-There was this joke
back in the day

00:45:12.960 --> 00:45:15.560
that the authentic version of
lesbian sex

00:45:15.600 --> 00:45:18.640
was holding hands
in 20 passionate positions.

00:45:20.680 --> 00:45:24.120
Because it was the only way
that you could possibly

00:45:24.160 --> 00:45:26.400
remove all inequality.

00:45:27.720 --> 00:45:29.800
You can't go around
telling people

00:45:29.840 --> 00:45:31.840
who they're allowed
to have sex with

00:45:31.880 --> 00:45:34.440
or how they're allowed to
have sex.

00:45:37.000 --> 00:45:38.800
LISA: I think there were quite
a lot of women

00:45:38.840 --> 00:45:40.960
who got labelled S and M dykes

00:45:41.000 --> 00:45:44.480
who probably did very little
S and M activity in bed.

00:45:44.520 --> 00:45:46.040
But I swear a lot of people
joined in

00:45:46.080 --> 00:45:48.000
cos they were having
more fun.

00:45:49.720 --> 00:45:52.640
♪ Does it fuck you off

00:45:52.680 --> 00:45:55.840
♪ When dykes strap on?

00:45:57.160 --> 00:46:01.160
♪ "They're taking over
our clubs!"

00:46:01.200 --> 00:46:04.520
♪ Does it fuck you off?

00:46:13.800 --> 00:46:15.280
♪ Drag king! ♪

00:46:15.320 --> 00:46:18.520
I honestly believed that we
could actually win

00:46:18.560 --> 00:46:21.320
fights and battles and it was
up for grabs.

00:46:21.360 --> 00:46:23.200
They were not gonna
take it from us

00:46:23.240 --> 00:46:25.160
and they were not gonna tell us
what to do.

00:46:25.200 --> 00:46:27.800
So I think the anti-censorship
battle

00:46:27.840 --> 00:46:30.640
was one of those battles
that they weren't gonna be able

00:46:30.680 --> 00:46:33.680
to tell us what we could
and couldn't read.

00:46:33.720 --> 00:46:36.200
Particularly when it was about
our own sexuality

00:46:36.240 --> 00:46:37.720
and our own identity.

00:46:37.760 --> 00:46:40.280
And, unfortunately for
the radical feminists,

00:46:40.320 --> 00:46:41.920
they picked the wrong side

00:46:41.960 --> 00:46:43.920
when they went against
pornography

00:46:43.960 --> 00:46:46.360
and they went against
people's own sexuality.

00:46:46.400 --> 00:46:49.120
They were just, like,
so off message.

00:46:49.160 --> 00:46:51.360
Because the bottom line was,

00:46:51.400 --> 00:46:54.000
"We love women.
We really love women."

00:47:05.600 --> 00:47:07.680
-Quim was a lesbian magazine

00:47:07.720 --> 00:47:10.280
for dykes of all
sexual persuasions.

00:47:10.320 --> 00:47:13.600
The first issue was
on penetration

00:47:13.640 --> 00:47:15.200
and we asked questions about

00:47:15.240 --> 00:47:17.320
what your experience
of penetration was.

00:47:17.360 --> 00:47:20.480
Cos at the time,
it was a bit of a no-no.

00:47:20.520 --> 00:47:23.080
Obviously, a lot of us
were doing it

00:47:23.120 --> 00:47:27.080
but there was a whole
politics around it.

00:47:27.120 --> 00:47:29.320
So we thought,
well, we'll just say,

00:47:29.360 --> 00:47:31.480
"What is it for you?
How does it feel for you?"

00:47:31.520 --> 00:47:34.360
And the idea was
to give everybody

00:47:34.400 --> 00:47:36.240
their voice and their say.

00:47:42.120 --> 00:47:44.560
When I first came out,

00:47:44.600 --> 00:47:46.720
and first, you know,

00:47:46.760 --> 00:47:48.840
found out about dildos,
essentially,

00:47:48.880 --> 00:47:51.320
we were lucky if we could get
black rubber dildos.

00:47:51.360 --> 00:47:53.200
But they always had balls
on them.

00:47:53.240 --> 00:47:56.040
So, of course, all the lesbians
would chop off the balls.

00:47:56.080 --> 00:47:58.280
And they were really quite
ugly. And then, of course,

00:47:58.320 --> 00:48:00.360
you couldn't keep them held in
very well.

00:48:00.400 --> 00:48:03.040
So there were always
chopped-off, lobbed-off bits.

00:48:04.240 --> 00:48:05.840
And then when I moved
to San Francisco,

00:48:05.880 --> 00:48:09.920
my first dildo,
I bought at Good Vibrations.

00:48:09.960 --> 00:48:14.400
And not very hygienic
but it was a leather one.

00:48:14.440 --> 00:48:16.600
But it didn't have balls,
so it was the first one

00:48:16.640 --> 00:48:18.800
we'd ever seen
that didn't have balls.

00:48:18.840 --> 00:48:21.080
So that was my first one.

00:48:21.120 --> 00:48:24.400
Then, of course, coming back
to London.

00:48:24.440 --> 00:48:28.440
And Ky Hoyle,
who is the MD of Sh!,

00:48:28.480 --> 00:48:30.280
she is also a rebel dyke

00:48:30.320 --> 00:48:33.520
and Sh! was born out of this
period when we were saying,

00:48:33.560 --> 00:48:35.360
"We don't wanna be dictated to

00:48:35.400 --> 00:48:39.400
"about how we should
be having sex.

00:48:39.440 --> 00:48:41.560
"We don't want people to tell
us what to do.

00:48:41.600 --> 00:48:46.160
"It's women's right to decide
on their own sexuality."

00:48:46.200 --> 00:48:50.520
And very much that we
don't want penises.

00:48:50.560 --> 00:48:52.200
You know, we do want
penetration

00:48:52.240 --> 00:48:53.560
but we don't want penises.

00:48:53.600 --> 00:48:56.440
So, Sh! started making dildos -

00:48:56.480 --> 00:48:59.680
ball-free,
un-penis-like dildos -

00:48:59.720 --> 00:49:02.600
which sort of revolutionised,
really.

00:49:02.640 --> 00:49:05.360
Lesbians then could actually
finally

00:49:05.400 --> 00:49:07.520
get hold of things
that they wanted.

00:49:07.560 --> 00:49:10.120
MUSIC: Wrapped Up In Sex
by Mouth Almighty

00:49:19.160 --> 00:49:20.920
With my girlfriend at the time,

00:49:20.960 --> 00:49:24.080
I ran the first mail-order
sex-toy business

00:49:24.120 --> 00:49:26.160
by lesbians for women,
we always said.

00:49:26.200 --> 00:49:27.920
And it was called
Thrilling Bits.

00:49:27.960 --> 00:49:31.080
Which was terrific, because I
was able to stand up on a chair

00:49:31.120 --> 00:49:32.600
at places like Fallen Angel
and go,

00:49:32.640 --> 00:49:34.840
"I'm one of the women
with Thrilling Bits."

00:49:36.040 --> 00:49:38.160
We imported terrific stuff
from San Francisco,

00:49:38.200 --> 00:49:40.840
which was a bit hairy because
customs didn't like it.

00:49:40.880 --> 00:49:42.880
And so, we had to name
all these things,

00:49:42.920 --> 00:49:44.720
because we weren't gonna give
them the names

00:49:44.760 --> 00:49:46.560
they had in the straight
catalogues,

00:49:46.600 --> 00:49:48.120
which were all really sleazy.

00:49:49.320 --> 00:49:51.560
So we named them
after famous lesbians

00:49:51.600 --> 00:49:55.120
or women we thought ought
to be lesbians, were icons.

00:49:55.160 --> 00:49:58.480
So, we had a Dusty.
We had other things like that.

00:49:58.520 --> 00:50:02.200
And our sense of humour
got the better of us again.

00:50:02.240 --> 00:50:04.320
And so we called our smallest,

00:50:04.360 --> 00:50:06.920
most inoffensive vibrator

00:50:06.960 --> 00:50:10.280
the Sheila,
after Sheila Jeffreys,

00:50:10.320 --> 00:50:14.600
a radical feminist separatist,
who went through the roof.

00:50:16.000 --> 00:50:18.480
One of the things we sold -
and we sold quite a lot of -

00:50:18.520 --> 00:50:22.040
were dental dams, and they were
actually squares of latex

00:50:22.080 --> 00:50:25.640
and you were supposed to
use them for cunnilingus.

00:50:25.680 --> 00:50:27.680
So if you were going down on
your girlfriend,

00:50:27.720 --> 00:50:29.520
you would put this between
you and her

00:50:29.560 --> 00:50:31.520
and it was the equivalent
of a condom,

00:50:31.560 --> 00:50:34.000
except they were thicker than
condoms,

00:50:34.040 --> 00:50:37.360
they used to come covered
in medical talcum powder,

00:50:37.400 --> 00:50:39.800
so you had to wash them
before you went anywhere.

00:50:39.840 --> 00:50:42.440
People tried to manufacture,
sort of,

00:50:42.480 --> 00:50:45.440
little harnesses for them, like
those things you used to have

00:50:45.480 --> 00:50:47.760
with sanitary towels
in the '60s.

00:50:47.800 --> 00:50:49.880
It was these strange harnesses.

00:50:49.920 --> 00:50:51.320
People tried
all those things

00:50:51.360 --> 00:50:52.880
but it was completely
pointless,

00:50:52.920 --> 00:50:56.760
cos it's very, very, very
difficult indeed

00:50:56.800 --> 00:50:58.320
to pass HIV
through cunnilingus.

00:50:58.360 --> 00:51:00.800
But we weren't entirely
certain about that at the time.

00:51:00.840 --> 00:51:02.040
Like, people used to put them

00:51:02.080 --> 00:51:04.440
on their coffee tables
as discussion.

00:51:05.800 --> 00:51:09.000
I was actually running this
business at the same time

00:51:09.040 --> 00:51:12.680
that I was helping to found
the Stonewall Group,

00:51:12.720 --> 00:51:15.280
as we called it then -
Stonewall now.

00:51:15.320 --> 00:51:17.440
And we would have
meetings in my living room

00:51:17.480 --> 00:51:20.240
and I remember one time, we'd
just had a shipment of stuff

00:51:20.280 --> 00:51:23.320
from America and we got out
the dental dams

00:51:23.360 --> 00:51:25.160
and the lesbian-porn
magazines -

00:51:25.200 --> 00:51:26.960
On Our Backs
and all that stuff -

00:51:27.000 --> 00:51:29.120
and showed it
to everyone who was there.

00:51:29.160 --> 00:51:31.560
And Stonewall was mixed -
lesbian and gay -

00:51:31.600 --> 00:51:35.440
and I remember the group
passed this dental dam around,

00:51:35.480 --> 00:51:38.040
pretty much in two fingers
from one to the other.

00:51:38.080 --> 00:51:40.760
And, God bless him,
Ian McKellen looked at it,

00:51:40.800 --> 00:51:43.440
stretched it, pulled it about
and went, "May I?"

00:51:43.480 --> 00:51:45.680
"Do what you like with it."
He just pulled it to his mouth

00:51:45.720 --> 00:51:47.240
and stuck his tongue
through it,

00:51:47.280 --> 00:51:49.560
and experimented with how it
would actually be to use it.

00:51:49.600 --> 00:51:51.040
And I just thought, "Oh, God,

00:51:51.080 --> 00:51:53.080
"I wish I had a camera
at the moment."

00:51:53.120 --> 00:51:54.920
You know, one of our great
stage actors

00:51:54.960 --> 00:51:56.400
having fun with a dental dam.

00:52:14.680 --> 00:52:19.360
I had started photographing
queer dyke life in 1982.

00:52:20.560 --> 00:52:25.240
Love Bites was created by a
kind of sexual performativity.

00:52:25.280 --> 00:52:29.600
Instead of performing what was
actually going on in the clubs,

00:52:29.640 --> 00:52:33.440
because we all wanted that to
be a safe and private space,

00:52:33.480 --> 00:52:37.240
instead, we kind of created
sexual happenings.

00:52:38.480 --> 00:52:43.120
We created, like, a lot of
interest and intrigue

00:52:43.160 --> 00:52:47.200
in what we were doing, and we
were performing for each other.

00:52:47.240 --> 00:52:50.040
At the time,
the sex wars were raging.

00:52:51.600 --> 00:52:53.160
They were trying to exclude us.

00:52:57.000 --> 00:53:00.160
The radical lesbian separatists
did still have

00:53:00.200 --> 00:53:02.320
quite a lot of power
at that time.

00:53:02.360 --> 00:53:04.680
SOPHIE: Many book shops
wouldn't stock it

00:53:04.720 --> 00:53:08.280
because they thought
it wasn't feminist.

00:53:08.320 --> 00:53:10.840
And our argument was that we
were women

00:53:10.880 --> 00:53:14.200
and this was our lives
and we were feminists,

00:53:14.240 --> 00:53:17.360
and we may be experimenting
with sexuality

00:53:17.400 --> 00:53:19.720
but that did not mean
we weren't feminists.

00:53:19.760 --> 00:53:23.960
When Love Bites came out
in 1991,

00:53:24.000 --> 00:53:27.240
they successfully excluded
Love Bites

00:53:27.280 --> 00:53:29.600
from gay-and-lesbian
book shops -

00:53:29.640 --> 00:53:33.800
in Silver Moon,
Sisterwrite and Gay's The Word.

00:53:39.000 --> 00:53:40.560
When the book shop was opened,

00:53:40.600 --> 00:53:42.760
we were a lesbian, gay,
feminist book shop.

00:53:42.800 --> 00:53:45.000
It was different from gay
book shops in the past,

00:53:45.040 --> 00:53:46.640
which were book shops for men,

00:53:46.680 --> 00:53:49.200
where they could go and get
erotic material.

00:53:49.240 --> 00:53:52.040
And this was a book shop
set up by socialists

00:53:52.080 --> 00:53:53.480
and it was about ideas.

00:53:53.520 --> 00:53:58.680
So, gay politics and biography
and history and coming out.

00:53:58.720 --> 00:54:00.600
And it wasn't about selling
erotic magazines

00:54:00.640 --> 00:54:02.160
and we didn't sell them.

00:54:02.200 --> 00:54:03.880
You have to remember,
this was also the era

00:54:03.920 --> 00:54:06.000
when Gay's The Word book shop
in London

00:54:06.040 --> 00:54:08.920
was raided and seized.

00:54:08.960 --> 00:54:11.640
The case eventually
collapsed in court

00:54:11.680 --> 00:54:13.600
but the police were trying to
say things like

00:54:13.640 --> 00:54:16.360
The Joy Of Lesbian Sex was
inherently pornographic

00:54:16.400 --> 00:54:17.680
and things like that.

00:54:17.720 --> 00:54:20.000
Stuff that would not have
been pornographic

00:54:20.040 --> 00:54:22.400
amongst heterosexuals
was definitely pornographic

00:54:22.440 --> 00:54:23.880
if it was lesbian.

00:54:23.920 --> 00:54:28.280
On Our Backs was a lesbian
publication from San Francisco

00:54:28.320 --> 00:54:31.480
and it was essentially
mostly soft -

00:54:31.520 --> 00:54:34.640
a little bit, occasionally,
of hard - porn for lesbians.

00:54:34.680 --> 00:54:37.480
On Our Backs was definitely
a banned publication.

00:54:38.920 --> 00:54:43.040
I started as
photographic assistant

00:54:43.080 --> 00:54:45.520
and I went in there, sort of,

00:54:45.560 --> 00:54:48.440
on this mission to kind of
change the look of it a bit.

00:54:48.480 --> 00:54:51.160
I felt like...

00:54:51.200 --> 00:54:55.200
the style of the photographs
and the women

00:54:55.240 --> 00:54:58.600
was a bit old school and I
wanted to, kind of, you know,

00:54:58.640 --> 00:55:00.760
get the newer, younger
generation

00:55:00.800 --> 00:55:02.640
that was out there involved.

00:55:02.680 --> 00:55:04.360
LISA: It featured, actually,

00:55:04.400 --> 00:55:06.240
some of the English S and M
dykes,

00:55:06.280 --> 00:55:09.680
and it was run partly by
English women

00:55:09.720 --> 00:55:11.160
who'd gone out to
San Francisco.

00:55:11.200 --> 00:55:14.560
And that's where I first
met my London dykes, actually,

00:55:14.600 --> 00:55:19.800
and it was very early on in
my employment there.

00:55:19.840 --> 00:55:23.960
And I first met, er,

00:55:24.000 --> 00:55:26.840
Seija from Finland.

00:55:26.880 --> 00:55:29.640
She came into the office
one day

00:55:29.680 --> 00:55:34.000
and she had with her
Baya and Aphra.

00:55:34.040 --> 00:55:38.040
And I saw these women and I was
just kind of like,

00:55:38.080 --> 00:55:39.400
" Whoosh! Who are they?

00:55:39.440 --> 00:55:42.280
"OK. Pictures. I want to take
pictures with them."

00:55:46.840 --> 00:55:49.840
I was, at the time, still back
and forth between here

00:55:49.880 --> 00:55:52.640
and San Francisco
and I still had On Our Backs.

00:55:54.040 --> 00:55:56.600
So I was working with
Del La Grace.

00:55:56.640 --> 00:55:58.120
I love worked on Love Bites.

00:55:58.160 --> 00:56:00.600
I'd met Del in San Francisco

00:56:00.640 --> 00:56:03.600
and I interviewed Del for
On Our Backs.

00:56:03.640 --> 00:56:05.760
We became really good friends

00:56:05.800 --> 00:56:08.280
and we've worked together
ever since.

00:56:08.320 --> 00:56:10.840
JIM: One of the books that we
didn't stock at the start

00:56:10.880 --> 00:56:13.520
was Love Bites
when it came out.

00:56:13.560 --> 00:56:16.240
We were worried about it
and we took legal advice -

00:56:16.280 --> 00:56:17.760
we had a big meeting about it.

00:56:17.800 --> 00:56:20.800
Cos there were a number
of images in the book

00:56:20.840 --> 00:56:24.920
that we thought could make us
liable to prosecution.

00:56:24.960 --> 00:56:27.120
But I have to say, Sisterwrite,

00:56:27.160 --> 00:56:29.520
which was the women-of-colour
book shops,

00:56:29.560 --> 00:56:32.120
were the only ones who were
honest enough to say,

00:56:32.160 --> 00:56:34.560
"We disapprove of the content.

00:56:34.600 --> 00:56:38.400
"We do not support, you know,
lesbian SM."

00:56:38.440 --> 00:56:42.120
And we did this whole
performance march

00:56:42.160 --> 00:56:45.160
against the censorship
of Love Bites.

00:56:45.200 --> 00:56:49.640
I wasn't too worried about the
obscene-publications squad.

00:56:49.680 --> 00:56:53.120
There was all sorts of rules,
archaic rules,

00:56:53.160 --> 00:56:57.760
you know, to do with how erect
a dildo can be.

00:56:57.800 --> 00:57:02.120
It can only be... It has to be
less than 45 degrees.

00:57:02.160 --> 00:57:03.960
Really weird stuff.

00:57:05.040 --> 00:57:07.480
I didn't expect to find myself
in court

00:57:07.520 --> 00:57:10.680
for an over-45-degree dildo.

00:57:11.840 --> 00:57:14.200
It was an awful distraction,
all of that stuff,

00:57:14.240 --> 00:57:18.440
because, really, we wanted just
to get on with the creativity -

00:57:18.480 --> 00:57:20.560
exploring of
what we were doing.

00:57:33.440 --> 00:57:36.520
FISCH: And I think that started
the realisation that this was

00:57:36.560 --> 00:57:39.240
a backlash against people
for their sexuality.

00:57:39.280 --> 00:57:41.760
There was always this attempt
to silence.

00:57:41.800 --> 00:57:43.160
The Aids activism was...

00:57:43.200 --> 00:57:46.000
"Silence equals death" was one
of the slogans that we used,

00:57:46.040 --> 00:57:48.040
because nobody recognised us

00:57:48.080 --> 00:57:49.440
as a community

00:57:49.480 --> 00:57:51.080
and having a voice at all.

00:57:51.120 --> 00:57:56.040
-Act Up is the Aids Coalition
to Unleash Power

00:57:56.080 --> 00:57:58.680
and it's an Aids activist
group, which I got involved in

00:57:58.720 --> 00:58:03.080
after going to the '87
march on Washington

00:58:03.120 --> 00:58:06.040
and seeing the Names Project
be unfolded

00:58:06.080 --> 00:58:09.720
and just standing there
for hours,

00:58:09.760 --> 00:58:12.360
hearing name after name
after name.

00:58:20.760 --> 00:58:24.160
In Act Up, we wanted to talk
about women and Aids.

00:58:24.200 --> 00:58:27.120
One of the things that was
happening on the women's scene,

00:58:27.160 --> 00:58:30.120
on the dyke scene, is that
there was becoming a, sort of,

00:58:30.160 --> 00:58:32.400
faction that was saying,

00:58:32.440 --> 00:58:36.240
"Well, you know, we're
lesbians - we don't get Aids,"

00:58:36.280 --> 00:58:38.200
who became very judgemental.

00:58:38.240 --> 00:58:41.200
And so we needed to talk
about behaviour -

00:58:41.240 --> 00:58:44.000
that the virus was, you know,

00:58:44.040 --> 00:58:48.840
passed by behaviour and not
by identity, you know.

00:58:51.680 --> 00:58:53.880
It was great, because it really
did get people

00:58:53.920 --> 00:58:57.160
talking about
the nuts and bolts of,

00:58:57.200 --> 00:58:59.160
you know, what we did.

00:58:59.200 --> 00:59:01.840
You know, lesbians use
IV drugs.

00:59:03.320 --> 00:59:07.680
Lesbians are strippers
and sex workers.

00:59:07.720 --> 00:59:09.200
Erm...

00:59:09.240 --> 00:59:12.840
And something that very
few people talk about, but...

00:59:12.880 --> 00:59:15.880
lesbians sometimes
sleep with gay men.

00:59:15.920 --> 00:59:18.600
And, you know, with men.
But also with gay men.

00:59:18.640 --> 00:59:21.760
The proximity - um...

00:59:21.800 --> 00:59:24.840
And in those days, you know,
drugs, party -

00:59:24.880 --> 00:59:27.720
you know, things happen.

00:59:36.320 --> 00:59:40.360
But I think particularly with
sex workers it was an issue,

00:59:40.400 --> 00:59:42.240
because there was...

00:59:42.280 --> 00:59:45.160
From one faction, there was
this whole attitude that,

00:59:45.200 --> 00:59:49.440
you know, if you slept with men
in any way, shape or form,

00:59:49.480 --> 00:59:51.200
you were not a lesbian.

01:00:24.560 --> 01:00:27.000
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

01:00:28.040 --> 01:00:32.120
Up until then, lesbians are not
seen as particularly activist

01:00:32.160 --> 01:00:35.480
and the gay-male scene was
split between activist gays,

01:00:35.520 --> 01:00:38.560
who all wore loads of badges
and did gay volunteering

01:00:38.600 --> 01:00:40.680
work for Switchboard or Friend
or whatever,

01:00:40.720 --> 01:00:43.440
and scene queens who went to
Heaven and all those things,

01:00:43.480 --> 01:00:45.360
and none of the groups
got together.

01:00:45.400 --> 01:00:47.440
And lesbians didn't mix
much with gay men

01:00:47.480 --> 01:00:49.640
and the two types of gay men
didn't mix much.

01:00:49.680 --> 01:00:53.600
Section 28, as well as HIV,
brought us all together.

01:00:53.640 --> 01:00:56.000
CHEERING

01:00:56.040 --> 01:00:59.240
Section 28 of the
Local Government Act

01:00:59.280 --> 01:01:03.520
said that local authorities
were not allowed

01:01:03.560 --> 01:01:09.000
to promote homosexuality as
a pretend family relationship.

01:01:09.040 --> 01:01:10.640
And these are
the sort of things

01:01:10.680 --> 01:01:12.960
that made us rebel dykes.
It wasn't we just woke up

01:01:13.000 --> 01:01:15.040
one morning and goes,
"Oh, let's be rebels."

01:01:15.080 --> 01:01:17.480
We actually had things
to rebel against.

01:01:19.760 --> 01:01:24.520
My girlfriend in the late '70s,
early '80s -

01:01:24.560 --> 01:01:26.920
she'd left her husband to come
and live with me

01:01:26.960 --> 01:01:28.320
and brought her baby.

01:01:28.360 --> 01:01:32.520
He took the baby
and he never came back.

01:01:32.560 --> 01:01:35.640
And we were both very
distraught.

01:01:35.680 --> 01:01:37.280
Like, "What's going on?"

01:01:37.320 --> 01:01:40.280
This solicitor who we hired
took the case to court

01:01:40.320 --> 01:01:42.280
and the judge ruled
in his favour

01:01:42.320 --> 01:01:44.040
because we were lesbians!

01:01:46.000 --> 01:01:47.720
That's why we were rebels.

01:01:47.760 --> 01:01:51.120
Children who need to be
taught to respect

01:01:51.160 --> 01:01:53.440
traditional moral values

01:01:53.480 --> 01:01:58.440
are being taught that they have
an inalienable right to be gay.

01:01:58.480 --> 01:02:01.320
-To have Margaret Thatcher's
government come up with an idea

01:02:01.360 --> 01:02:03.320
that your relationships
were pretend

01:02:03.360 --> 01:02:05.240
and that you should be
silenced,

01:02:05.280 --> 01:02:07.160
you shouldn't be
allowed to be spoken of -

01:02:07.200 --> 01:02:09.560
it was a really
outraging feeling.

01:02:10.680 --> 01:02:13.200
It was, you know,
quite celebratory in the '80s.

01:02:13.240 --> 01:02:15.320
There was a lot of fun and
pleasure in it

01:02:15.360 --> 01:02:17.360
and we'd moved on a lot,
I think, from the kind of

01:02:17.400 --> 01:02:20.120
'50s or '60s sense of people
feeling a bit apologetic

01:02:20.160 --> 01:02:22.800
about their sexuality,
to feeling great about it.

01:02:26.640 --> 01:02:29.480
Hi! We're all gay -
it's great, innit?

01:02:29.520 --> 01:02:31.440
LAUGHTER

01:02:33.200 --> 01:02:35.400
We went on a lot of matches
against clause 28.

01:02:35.440 --> 01:02:39.560
It was horrifying, because I
had so recently been at school

01:02:39.600 --> 01:02:44.160
and then clause 28 was coming
to really stop even teachers

01:02:44.200 --> 01:02:46.960
being able to respond to
a child

01:02:47.000 --> 01:02:49.840
who might be in real danger.

01:02:49.880 --> 01:02:53.400
Even if you've got nice
parents, it's hard to come out.

01:02:53.440 --> 01:02:55.720
So a teacher is
the next port of call

01:02:55.760 --> 01:02:57.920
and they weren't allowed
to even listen

01:02:57.960 --> 01:03:00.240
or even respond in
any positive way.

01:03:00.280 --> 01:03:03.400
It was just hor...
We knew that it was dangerous.

01:03:03.440 --> 01:03:05.880
We knew already that
people killed themselves

01:03:05.920 --> 01:03:08.920
because they needed
to come out.

01:03:08.960 --> 01:03:12.480
And then the government was
telling teachers

01:03:12.520 --> 01:03:13.960
that they can't be themselves.

01:03:14.000 --> 01:03:15.400
It's relationships.

01:03:15.440 --> 01:03:18.560
You can't start
by being covered up

01:03:18.600 --> 01:03:21.640
and being restricted
and being scared.

01:03:21.680 --> 01:03:24.280
-It was quite
a pernicious idea

01:03:24.320 --> 01:03:26.560
within this
Local Government Act

01:03:26.600 --> 01:03:29.320
that the promotion of
homosexuality

01:03:29.360 --> 01:03:31.280
should be outlawed in schools.

01:03:31.320 --> 01:03:36.120
And in particular that schools
should not be able to teach

01:03:36.160 --> 01:03:39.000
what they called a pretended
family relationship -

01:03:39.040 --> 01:03:41.840
that having two lesbian
mothers, for instance,

01:03:41.880 --> 01:03:43.200
was actually a family,

01:03:43.240 --> 01:03:45.080
but they were saying
that's not a real family.

01:03:45.120 --> 01:03:48.240
It felt like it was mainly
gay people fighting it.

01:03:48.280 --> 01:03:50.080
There were straight people
fighting it

01:03:50.120 --> 01:03:53.600
but I didn't feel like the
media was supporting the fight.

01:03:53.640 --> 01:03:55.800
Erm...

01:03:55.840 --> 01:03:58.040
Yeah, it felt quite scary,

01:03:58.080 --> 01:04:00.200
like that we weren't going to
win.

01:04:00.240 --> 01:04:02.680
We were talking to ourselves
by the '80s.

01:04:02.720 --> 01:04:04.360
We were completely
self-referential,

01:04:04.400 --> 01:04:06.400
internal looking. We weren't
capable

01:04:06.440 --> 01:04:08.400
of talking to anybody
we didn't agree with.

01:04:08.440 --> 01:04:12.680
We weren't capable of
the grand gesture

01:04:12.720 --> 01:04:16.320
and the thing that happened
with Section 28

01:04:16.360 --> 01:04:19.240
and the abseilers was that the
grand gesture came back

01:04:19.280 --> 01:04:23.120
and the grand gesture came back
led by lesbians.

01:04:23.160 --> 01:04:25.960
SUSANNAH: And I think for us,
that came very naturally.

01:04:26.000 --> 01:04:28.040
That was the kind of...
I think, part of, in a way,

01:04:28.080 --> 01:04:30.760
the training camp that Greenham
Common was for activist women

01:04:30.800 --> 01:04:32.760
and for activist dykes
at that time.

01:04:34.240 --> 01:04:36.080
Greenham was very much
about that,

01:04:36.120 --> 01:04:37.880
about doing physical things -

01:04:37.920 --> 01:04:42.640
cutting fences, blockading,
entering the USAF base,

01:04:42.680 --> 01:04:45.360
pushing at boundaries and
stepping over boundaries

01:04:45.400 --> 01:04:49.320
and making quite symbolic
actions that, you know,

01:04:49.360 --> 01:04:50.920
were headline grabbing as well.

01:04:50.960 --> 01:04:53.560
We were quite conscious of
that - the way to use the media

01:04:53.600 --> 01:04:55.520
and grab headlines in that way.

01:04:55.560 --> 01:04:57.920
It was actually loads and loads
of women who'd never been

01:04:57.960 --> 01:05:01.400
seen before, absolutely
livid at this legislation.

01:05:01.440 --> 01:05:03.680
SUSANNAH: We had a meeting at
my flat in Clapham

01:05:03.720 --> 01:05:05.160
to talk about direct action

01:05:05.200 --> 01:05:06.720
and where we wanted to
go with it next.

01:05:06.760 --> 01:05:09.400
There was a debate in the
House of Lords coming up

01:05:09.440 --> 01:05:11.760
and the first idea we had was
a bit more ambitious -

01:05:11.800 --> 01:05:16.240
we wanted to hijack a boat and
board the Palace of Westminster

01:05:16.280 --> 01:05:19.000
from the river, sort of
storm it from the river.

01:05:19.040 --> 01:05:21.280
And, you know, we were
seriously talking this through

01:05:21.320 --> 01:05:23.040
but there was issues of
the tide times

01:05:23.080 --> 01:05:25.280
and where we were going to get
this boat and everything,

01:05:25.320 --> 01:05:27.800
so it was maybe a
little bit ambitious.

01:05:27.840 --> 01:05:30.240
And then I think we were...

01:05:30.280 --> 01:05:31.920
I think the TV might have
been on.

01:05:31.960 --> 01:05:34.240
We were reminded of the way
the House of Lords is, where

01:05:34.280 --> 01:05:37.240
there's the public gallery
above where the lords sit.

01:05:37.280 --> 01:05:40.720
And so, we had this idea
of abseiling in, or sliding in.

01:05:40.760 --> 01:05:43.120
A couple of people went...
Sally and Janet, I think,

01:05:43.160 --> 01:05:44.480
went up Clapham High Street

01:05:44.520 --> 01:05:46.480
and bought a couple of
washing lines,

01:05:46.520 --> 01:05:48.280
and we kind of chopped those
into four

01:05:48.320 --> 01:05:49.920
and then we wrapped them...

01:05:49.960 --> 01:05:52.520
Like, four of us had them
under our jumpers

01:05:52.560 --> 01:05:53.960
or whatever,
wrapped around us.

01:05:54.000 --> 01:05:55.840
We were queueing to get into
the House of Lords

01:05:55.880 --> 01:05:58.280
for this debate, so Paula was
kind of shouting out,

01:05:58.320 --> 01:06:00.120
"Are you a lord?
Are you a lord?

01:06:00.160 --> 01:06:01.280
"Can you sign us in as a guest

01:06:01.320 --> 01:06:04.120
"to come into your guest
gallery?" And before too long,

01:06:04.160 --> 01:06:06.640
one guy said,
"Yes, OK, I'll take you in."

01:06:06.680 --> 01:06:09.680
So, he signed in
four or five of us

01:06:09.720 --> 01:06:12.720
and we went into this side
gallery, which was lucky,

01:06:12.760 --> 01:06:15.400
actually, because the visitors'
gallery is significantly lower

01:06:15.440 --> 01:06:16.760
than the public gallery.

01:06:18.400 --> 01:06:21.080
So, we were sitting there and
the debate was going on

01:06:21.120 --> 01:06:23.600
and I can't... You know,
it's a very adrenaline-y thing.

01:06:23.640 --> 01:06:25.680
I can't honestly remember
much about it now.

01:06:25.720 --> 01:06:27.520
But got these ropes out,
tied them to

01:06:27.560 --> 01:06:31.160
the little wrought-iron balcony
and pitched over.

01:06:31.200 --> 01:06:33.680
I kind of got rope burns
going down this nylon thing

01:06:33.720 --> 01:06:35.920
very badly to the floor,

01:06:35.960 --> 01:06:38.320
and then other friends who were
in the public gallery

01:06:38.360 --> 01:06:41.200
were shouting and, you know,
kicking off and everything.

01:06:41.240 --> 01:06:43.400
Their security moved
quite quickly.

01:06:43.440 --> 01:06:45.760
They held us in there for
a good number of hours.

01:06:45.800 --> 01:06:47.680
We didn't get
charged with anything at all.

01:06:47.720 --> 01:06:49.640
They could have
charges within their own bylaws

01:06:49.680 --> 01:06:52.120
but I think they just thought,
"Let's get rid of them."

01:06:52.160 --> 01:06:54.840
And this actually caused
a huge stir, because it was

01:06:54.880 --> 01:06:58.520
the first time that a lot of
gay men had seen lesbians

01:06:58.560 --> 01:07:00.440
involved in direct action

01:07:00.480 --> 01:07:02.360
and doing something
that was for everybody.

01:07:02.400 --> 01:07:05.680
It was lesbians who became
the outrageous activists.

01:07:05.720 --> 01:07:09.600
SUSANNAH: The invasion of
the Six O'Clock News at the BBC

01:07:09.640 --> 01:07:12.520
was another high-profile action
that we did.

01:07:12.560 --> 01:07:14.480
I didn't actually go in there
but I was, kind of,

01:07:14.520 --> 01:07:16.120
involved in
the thinking about it.

01:07:16.160 --> 01:07:18.520
Red and Stella in particular,
who'd been on the abseiling,

01:07:18.560 --> 01:07:20.360
and then various other dykes

01:07:20.400 --> 01:07:21.760
who hadn't been on
the abseiling

01:07:21.800 --> 01:07:24.160
but were really, really keen
to do some more direct action

01:07:24.200 --> 01:07:27.720
around Clause 28, came together
in a new group

01:07:27.760 --> 01:07:31.600
for activists
and we started to plan.

01:07:31.640 --> 01:07:35.560
It was helped by the fact that
one of the dykes

01:07:35.600 --> 01:07:38.720
had a friend who worked,
I think, as a runner in the BBC

01:07:38.760 --> 01:07:41.400
and passed us a floor plan,

01:07:41.440 --> 01:07:45.520
so that they had an idea of
where the studio actually was

01:07:45.560 --> 01:07:47.640
in this massive TV Centre.

01:07:53.640 --> 01:07:55.640
There was quite a lot of
hair-raising bits

01:07:55.680 --> 01:07:57.880
of being on completely
the wrong floor.

01:07:57.920 --> 01:07:59.840
I seem to remember they had to,
sort of,

01:07:59.880 --> 01:08:02.200
lock themselves in the toilet
for quite a long time.

01:08:02.240 --> 01:08:03.880
They were a bit more
organised this time -

01:08:03.920 --> 01:08:05.800
they had T-shirts with
"stop the clause" on.

01:08:05.840 --> 01:08:07.480
I think they had to go and
strip off

01:08:07.520 --> 01:08:09.440
and get their T-shirts
in place.

01:08:09.480 --> 01:08:11.760
But, anyway, they kind of
pulled it together, as we know,

01:08:11.800 --> 01:08:13.880
cos we do have the film
footage of that.

01:08:15.840 --> 01:08:19.160
And they got into this studio
and padlocked themselves

01:08:19.200 --> 01:08:20.680
to the bottom of the desk,

01:08:20.720 --> 01:08:23.560
which is why they couldn't
so easily get rid of them,

01:08:23.600 --> 01:08:25.560
and you could hear
these muffled voices

01:08:25.600 --> 01:08:26.720
from under the desk.

01:08:28.960 --> 01:08:31.800
The Six O'Clock News from
the BBC,

01:08:31.840 --> 01:08:34.320
with Sue Lawley and
Nicholas Witchell.

01:08:34.360 --> 01:08:37.440
Good evening.
The headlines at six o'clock...

01:08:37.480 --> 01:08:40.040
In the House of Lords,
a vote is taking place now

01:08:40.080 --> 01:08:42.280
on a challenge to the poll tax.
Tory rebels have said...

01:08:42.320 --> 01:08:44.320
-This is about rights
for lesbian and gay people.

01:08:44.360 --> 01:08:45.800
-..the tax is unfair
and unpopular.

01:08:45.840 --> 01:08:47.480
-Stop Section 28.
-And I do apologise

01:08:47.520 --> 01:08:49.600
if you're hearing quite a lot
of noise in the studio.

01:08:49.640 --> 01:08:51.640
-Stop the clause.
-I'm afraid that we have rather

01:08:51.680 --> 01:08:53.720
been invaded by some people
that we hope

01:08:53.760 --> 01:08:55.480
to be removing shortly.

01:08:55.520 --> 01:08:56.840
In the meantime...

01:08:56.880 --> 01:08:59.000
And Sue Lawley holding it
together very well.

01:08:59.040 --> 01:09:01.720
I think we all have to agree
she did a masterful job there,

01:09:01.760 --> 01:09:03.040
whereas Nicholas Witchell,

01:09:03.080 --> 01:09:05.160
who then went on to be
the royal correspondent,

01:09:05.200 --> 01:09:06.920
you know, he got stuck in
off-camera...

01:09:06.960 --> 01:09:09.280
Get off me, you arsewipe.
Stop section 28!

01:09:09.320 --> 01:09:10.960
Stop section 28!

01:09:11.000 --> 01:09:12.920
..helping the security guards
to squash them

01:09:12.960 --> 01:09:14.240
and get on top of them.

01:09:19.000 --> 01:09:21.760
-And direct action
is important.

01:09:21.800 --> 01:09:24.920
With one thing done by half
a dozen people,

01:09:24.960 --> 01:09:27.080
you can be on
the Nine O'Clock News

01:09:27.120 --> 01:09:30.000
and reach the whole country,

01:09:30.040 --> 01:09:31.280
and make a point.

01:09:31.320 --> 01:09:34.120
And, you know,
sometimes it doesn't work,

01:09:34.160 --> 01:09:36.880
but when it really works,
by God it works.

01:09:36.920 --> 01:09:40.760
And it was horrific and yet,
looking back, it was the thing

01:09:40.800 --> 01:09:43.280
that brought us all together
and founded

01:09:43.320 --> 01:09:46.360
what has since become one of
the most successful

01:09:46.400 --> 01:09:49.280
lesbian and gay movements
in the world.

01:09:49.320 --> 01:09:52.280
Because it really pissed
a lot of people off.

01:09:57.840 --> 01:10:01.040
People really became aware of
how oppressive

01:10:01.080 --> 01:10:03.160
the Tory government
were becoming.

01:10:03.200 --> 01:10:06.080
Lots of people came out
and said, "This is not on."

01:10:06.120 --> 01:10:07.680
Then there was far
more marches,

01:10:07.720 --> 01:10:08.920
far more demonstrating,

01:10:08.960 --> 01:10:11.640
and it became very hardcore
with the police.

01:10:11.680 --> 01:10:14.800
And round the same period
was the poll-tax riot.

01:10:14.840 --> 01:10:17.120
We were pretty much doing
a riot a week, I think,

01:10:17.160 --> 01:10:19.800
at some points. There was a lot
going on

01:10:19.840 --> 01:10:22.800
where we were protesting
and agitating, really.

01:10:45.080 --> 01:10:48.920
About 1990, I kind of got
bored of the party lifestyle.

01:10:48.960 --> 01:10:52.640
You know, I wanted to do
something,

01:10:52.680 --> 01:10:55.280
yeah, bit more challenging.
I mean, it was fun

01:10:55.320 --> 01:10:59.160
but I just got bored of it.
You know, we didn't have...

01:10:59.200 --> 01:11:01.760
You can't do the same things
for years on end.

01:11:07.000 --> 01:11:08.560
ROZ: I moved on.

01:11:08.600 --> 01:11:10.520
There was a point where
I dropped out of

01:11:10.560 --> 01:11:12.440
the Chain Reaction collective.

01:11:13.640 --> 01:11:17.000
DEL: She was pretty much
excluded - not exactly

01:11:17.040 --> 01:11:21.600
for being trans but that was
a factor that was used.

01:11:21.640 --> 01:11:24.520
It was weird because, like,
nobody would actually say

01:11:24.560 --> 01:11:26.600
what I'd done and most people
just got the idea

01:11:26.640 --> 01:11:28.680
I'd done something
and it was awful.

01:11:28.720 --> 01:11:31.560
Maybe Roz slept with
the wrong person.

01:11:38.000 --> 01:11:39.800
In the end, all of the fights

01:11:39.840 --> 01:11:43.160
and the debates within feminism
absolutely got me down

01:11:43.200 --> 01:11:46.000
and in the end, I left London
because it just did my head in.

01:11:47.280 --> 01:11:49.200
I tried to find a squat in
Amsterdam.

01:11:49.240 --> 01:11:51.120
It was fucking freezing.

01:11:53.160 --> 01:11:56.040
Every day, I would take
an acid tab.

01:11:58.000 --> 01:12:01.440
I just lived in this completely
psychedelic, fucked-up world.

01:12:01.480 --> 01:12:04.160
I ended up getting arrested
on some demonstration.

01:12:04.200 --> 01:12:05.760
I still, to this day,
don't know

01:12:05.800 --> 01:12:07.680
what the demonstration
was even for.

01:12:11.000 --> 01:12:12.760
And it was actually during
those three days

01:12:12.800 --> 01:12:15.360
in the police station when I,
sort of, detoxed off drugs

01:12:15.400 --> 01:12:17.480
and realised this wasn't
a very good idea.

01:12:20.760 --> 01:12:23.040
MAJ: After being a traveller
for about a year,

01:12:23.080 --> 01:12:24.280
which didn't really work,

01:12:24.320 --> 01:12:26.560
I found myself in
Women Only Space.

01:12:26.600 --> 01:12:30.120
So, it's a rural women-only
community.

01:12:30.160 --> 01:12:32.320
It was bought and paid for by
some of the women

01:12:32.360 --> 01:12:34.000
coming from Greenham.

01:12:34.040 --> 01:12:35.760
I don't want to say
exactly where it is,

01:12:35.800 --> 01:12:37.960
because it's
kind of like a women's refuge.

01:12:46.600 --> 01:12:48.920
People went on and became
famous artists,

01:12:48.960 --> 01:12:50.240
famous film-makers,

01:12:50.280 --> 01:12:54.080
lecturers, journalists,
barristers, nurses.

01:12:54.120 --> 01:12:55.440
All sorts of things.

01:13:02.000 --> 01:13:05.000
DEBBIE: A few months after
Mouth Almighty split,

01:13:05.040 --> 01:13:07.560
I actually got my first job

01:13:07.600 --> 01:13:10.600
as an indie guitarist with
the band Curve.

01:13:10.640 --> 01:13:12.520
I saw them
on the telly on the Monday,

01:13:12.560 --> 01:13:14.640
answered the advert on
the Wednesday.

01:13:14.680 --> 01:13:17.120
I went to the audition
on the Friday

01:13:17.160 --> 01:13:20.040
and was in the band by
tea-time. So, that was good.

01:13:20.080 --> 01:13:22.240
ROCK MUSIC PLAYS

01:13:45.000 --> 01:13:48.280
At least, I hope that nowadays
for young people

01:13:48.320 --> 01:13:50.760
it's much easier to be
what they are.

01:13:50.800 --> 01:13:55.000
And I think it's taken these
30 years to develop,

01:13:55.040 --> 01:13:58.080
that people can start feeling
more comfortable

01:13:58.120 --> 01:13:59.680
in the way they feel inside.

01:14:03.280 --> 01:14:05.360
YVONNE: I'm about to start
a new club,

01:14:05.400 --> 01:14:07.120
which is about
all women welcome.

01:14:07.160 --> 01:14:10.360
It means queer folks,
it means non-binary.

01:14:14.040 --> 01:14:16.760
You know, when I hear
my nieces and nephews

01:14:16.800 --> 01:14:18.720
talk about their experiences

01:14:18.760 --> 01:14:21.280
with gay and lesbian
young kids...

01:14:23.280 --> 01:14:25.480
..that's when I kind of go,
"We've moved on."

01:14:30.040 --> 01:14:33.640
The trouble is that we've gone
so far into the mainstream

01:14:33.680 --> 01:14:35.800
and we're so respectable now

01:14:35.840 --> 01:14:38.000
that we're losing all our sharp
edges and we're losing

01:14:38.040 --> 01:14:39.240
our ability to be the rebels.

01:14:39.280 --> 01:14:42.120
MUSIC PLAYS, WHISTLES BLOW

01:14:50.840 --> 01:14:55.440
One thing I find most
amusing is about SM,

01:14:55.480 --> 01:14:59.000
because it was very secretive
in the '80s.

01:14:59.040 --> 01:15:03.160
And it's taken all
these 30 years to become

01:15:03.200 --> 01:15:07.160
something, like,
of a normal thing.

01:15:07.200 --> 01:15:10.600
And now you see these books
like 50 Shades Of Grey

01:15:10.640 --> 01:15:12.040
and it's a normal thing.

01:15:12.080 --> 01:15:13.320
You know, anybody does it

01:15:13.360 --> 01:15:16.440
and they discuss it
in the workplace.

01:15:21.320 --> 01:15:24.440
I can have sex in private now
and still enjoy myself!

01:15:27.000 --> 01:15:30.080
Yeah, and in the end,
it isn't two groups, is it?

01:15:30.120 --> 01:15:32.040
-No groups are homogeneous.
-No.

01:15:32.080 --> 01:15:34.240
But the thing about us
as SM dykes

01:15:34.280 --> 01:15:36.600
was that we were ostracised
from the lesbian community,

01:15:36.640 --> 01:15:38.360
and so we formed a family
around that.

01:15:38.400 --> 01:15:40.600
And, you know, 30 years later,
we're still friends

01:15:40.640 --> 01:15:42.680
because there were
so very few of us

01:15:42.720 --> 01:15:45.560
that felt we were really
interested in sex

01:15:45.600 --> 01:15:47.760
and being positive about sex.

01:15:55.800 --> 01:15:58.680
SEIJA: It was like
a real energy

01:15:58.720 --> 01:16:00.760
of what people had they
wanted to say

01:16:00.800 --> 01:16:03.000
and they wanted to explore.

01:16:03.040 --> 01:16:07.680
And that's maybe why it
continued after the clubs

01:16:07.720 --> 01:16:09.160
and after the movement,

01:16:09.200 --> 01:16:13.080
that people took it in their
lives and they continued.

01:16:19.720 --> 01:16:23.800
Every Tuesday, we took over
a gay men's club in Vauxhall.

01:16:23.840 --> 01:16:28.200
We started the UK's first ever
lesbian S and M night,

01:16:28.240 --> 01:16:29.720
Chain Reaction.

01:16:29.760 --> 01:16:31.080
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

01:16:31.120 --> 01:16:32.680
Yay!

01:16:32.720 --> 01:16:36.200
We wanted what the gay men
had access to -

01:16:36.240 --> 01:16:38.480
places to have sex.

01:16:38.520 --> 01:16:40.800
CHEERING AND APPLAUSE

01:16:46.040 --> 01:16:49.040
ROCK MUSIC PLAYS

01:17:01.600 --> 01:17:04.640
The show I'm doing now
is my perspective

01:17:04.680 --> 01:17:09.520
of gay pride from the viewpoint
of a rebel dyke.

01:17:09.560 --> 01:17:11.680
There's that whole
thing of just being...

01:17:11.720 --> 01:17:15.000
Always challenging,
always challenging the norm,

01:17:15.040 --> 01:17:16.760
challenging what's expected,

01:17:16.800 --> 01:17:19.520
and getting power from
doing something else.

01:17:19.560 --> 01:17:22.680
And, you know, I've been called
"sir" my whole life!

01:17:22.720 --> 01:17:26.400
And so I thought, "OK, I could
probably be a drag king again."

01:17:26.440 --> 01:17:30.080
Funnily enough, the drag-king
community very much reminds me

01:17:30.120 --> 01:17:31.760
of the rebel dyke community,

01:17:31.800 --> 01:17:35.400
because we're a minority and
we've got each other's backs

01:17:35.440 --> 01:17:37.920
and that's a really, really
lovely feeling.

01:17:37.960 --> 01:17:40.480
MUSIC: Remember Me
by Mouth Almighty

01:17:59.680 --> 01:18:01.080
YVONNE: We, as older lesbians,

01:18:01.120 --> 01:18:05.040
have paved the way so younger
people can come along and have,

01:18:05.080 --> 01:18:07.200
kind of, like, the freedom
that they've got now.

01:18:07.240 --> 01:18:09.920
Not that most of us have
any clue...

01:18:09.960 --> 01:18:13.640
In the same way I have no clue
about all the previous,

01:18:13.680 --> 01:18:15.760
you know, older lesbians
that had gone before me.

01:18:15.800 --> 01:18:18.480
It's very necessary that
this story gets told,

01:18:18.520 --> 01:18:20.440
because we all stand on
the shoulders of giants.

01:18:20.480 --> 01:18:22.720
And if the women hadn't
started Gateways,

01:18:22.760 --> 01:18:24.760
we would never have
started Chain Reaction.

01:18:24.800 --> 01:18:27.640
But this story has been,
so far, unsaid.

01:18:27.680 --> 01:18:30.920
So I'm very happy that it's
finally been documented.

01:18:30.960 --> 01:18:33.800
MUSIC: Skirt
by Nightnurse

01:19:08.320 --> 01:19:10.280
LISA: I don't want to be
a straight gay,

01:19:10.320 --> 01:19:12.240
which is how we used to
refer to people like that

01:19:12.280 --> 01:19:14.000
in the '80s. For me,

01:19:14.040 --> 01:19:16.840
the whole point of
gay liberation,

01:19:16.880 --> 01:19:18.600
the whole point of coming out,

01:19:18.640 --> 01:19:20.480
is to come out as yourself.

01:19:20.520 --> 01:19:23.200
Whatever that is, wherever it
leads you,

01:19:23.240 --> 01:19:24.720
you should be yourself.

01:19:24.760 --> 01:19:28.680
And rebel dykes in the '80s
did that at a time

01:19:28.720 --> 01:19:31.480
when there were really
far too many people,

01:19:31.520 --> 01:19:35.000
both inside the movement
and in the general public,

01:19:35.040 --> 01:19:37.800
all trying to tell us
how to behave.

01:19:37.840 --> 01:19:40.120
DEBBIE: And, you know, we had
to fight long and hard

01:19:40.160 --> 01:19:42.440
to find our place
but, you know, we did.

01:19:42.480 --> 01:19:44.280
I mean, look at
lesbian society now.

01:19:44.320 --> 01:19:46.440
That's cos we did that.

01:19:46.480 --> 01:19:48.600
We did that. Be thankful.

01:20:02.000 --> 01:20:06.760
♪ I met a girl
and she didn't have a heart

01:20:06.800 --> 01:20:11.240
♪ But I never really found out
till the morning

01:20:11.280 --> 01:20:13.280
♪ I let her take me home

01:20:13.320 --> 01:20:16.000
♪ Even though I knew the signs

01:20:16.040 --> 01:20:20.120
♪ I know it wasn't smart
but I'm not sorry

01:20:23.600 --> 01:20:27.720
♪ What can you do
with a girl that has no heart?

01:20:27.760 --> 01:20:32.280
♪ We kept each other up
until the morning

01:20:32.320 --> 01:20:34.440
♪ So, even though I knew

01:20:34.480 --> 01:20:37.160
♪ She was trouble
from the start

01:20:37.200 --> 01:20:42.000
♪ I stayed another night
and I'm still yawning

01:20:44.360 --> 01:20:47.720
♪ Having no heart

01:20:47.760 --> 01:20:49.800
♪ You never need to care

01:20:49.840 --> 01:20:53.560
♪ You don't have to satisfy

01:20:53.600 --> 01:20:56.800
♪ It is the ones

01:20:56.840 --> 01:20:59.440
♪ You know you'll never have

01:20:59.480 --> 01:21:03.840
♪ You always want too much

01:21:03.880 --> 01:21:07.040
♪ End of story

01:21:08.920 --> 01:21:10.720
♪ I met a girl

01:21:10.760 --> 01:21:13.520
♪ She never had much time

01:21:13.560 --> 01:21:17.800
♪ She always had to rush out
in the morning

01:21:17.840 --> 01:21:19.960
♪ So, even though I knew

01:21:20.000 --> 01:21:22.760
♪ We were a million
worlds apart

01:21:22.800 --> 01:21:26.800
♪ I stayed another month
but I'm not sorry

01:21:29.760 --> 01:21:32.960
♪ Having no time

01:21:33.000 --> 01:21:35.400
♪ You never need to care

01:21:35.440 --> 01:21:38.880
♪ You don't have to justify

01:21:38.920 --> 01:21:42.360
♪ It is the ones

01:21:42.400 --> 01:21:44.680
♪ You know you'll never have

01:21:44.720 --> 01:21:49.200
♪ You always want too much

01:21:49.240 --> 01:21:52.760
♪ End of story

01:21:55.600 --> 01:22:00.000
♪ You can have it all

01:22:00.040 --> 01:22:04.840
♪ Practising freefall

01:22:04.880 --> 01:22:08.520
♪ Then you pay the toll

01:22:10.200 --> 01:22:14.160
♪ In the morning

01:22:34.400 --> 01:22:37.240
♪ Having no heart

01:22:37.280 --> 01:22:39.640
♪ You never need to care

01:22:39.680 --> 01:22:43.560
♪ You don't have to satisfy

01:22:43.600 --> 01:22:46.560
♪ It is the ones

01:22:46.600 --> 01:22:49.080
♪ You know you'll never have

01:22:49.120 --> 01:22:53.480
♪ You always want too much

01:22:53.520 --> 01:22:57.360
♪ End of story

01:22:59.000 --> 01:23:00.720
♪ I met a girl

01:23:00.760 --> 01:23:03.360
♪ She never had a heart

01:23:03.400 --> 01:23:07.360
♪ I should have known it
from the start

01:23:07.400 --> 01:23:11.560
♪ We were a million
worlds apart

01:23:11.600 --> 01:23:16.560
♪ Well, I know it wasn't smart

01:23:16.600 --> 01:23:19.040
♪ But I'm not

01:23:19.080 --> 01:23:20.640
♪ Sorry. ♪

01:23:29.040 --> 01:23:32.480
MUSIC: Trouble by
the Well Oiled Sisters

01:24:12.000 --> 01:24:15.680
♪ You don't know
the trouble I'm in

01:24:18.240 --> 01:24:22.520
♪ And you don't know
the trouble I've seen

01:24:24.880 --> 01:24:26.560
♪ Talking to myself

01:24:26.600 --> 01:24:29.280
♪ I'll drink to kill the pain

01:24:29.320 --> 01:24:32.880
♪ Knowing in my heart
that I won't see you again

01:24:32.920 --> 01:24:35.080
♪ I'm in trouble

01:24:37.000 --> 01:24:39.080
♪ I'm in trouble

01:24:41.360 --> 01:24:46.040
♪ So, please come home

01:24:46.080 --> 01:24:49.760
♪ Please come home

01:24:50.920 --> 01:24:54.280
♪ Please come home

01:24:54.320 --> 01:24:56.920
♪ I'm in trouble

01:24:58.640 --> 01:25:01.040
♪ I'm in trouble

01:25:03.320 --> 01:25:05.280
♪ You're so cold

01:25:05.320 --> 01:25:07.400
♪ You can't meet my eye

01:25:09.760 --> 01:25:11.640
♪ You laugh too loud

01:25:11.680 --> 01:25:14.160
♪ You calculate and lie

01:25:16.520 --> 01:25:18.280
♪ Looking at the stars

01:25:18.320 --> 01:25:20.560
♪ I'm waiting for a sign

01:25:20.600 --> 01:25:22.400
♪ If I don't lose my nerve

01:25:22.440 --> 01:25:24.640
♪ Then I'm gonna lose my mind

01:25:24.680 --> 01:25:26.560
♪ I'm in trouble

01:25:28.600 --> 01:25:31.120
♪ I'm in trouble

01:25:33.320 --> 01:25:36.960
♪ So, please come home

01:25:38.000 --> 01:25:41.040
♪ Please come home

01:25:42.320 --> 01:25:45.960
♪ Please come home

01:25:46.000 --> 01:25:48.720
♪ I'm in trouble

01:25:50.320 --> 01:25:52.960
♪ I'm in trouble

01:26:16.560 --> 01:26:20.440
♪ You don't know
the trouble I'm in

01:26:23.000 --> 01:26:27.120
♪ And you don't know
the trouble I've seen

01:26:29.840 --> 01:26:31.520
♪ Living in the past

01:26:31.560 --> 01:26:33.840
♪ I'm thinking about us

01:26:33.880 --> 01:26:35.720
♪ Counting out my change

01:26:35.760 --> 01:26:37.600
♪ And I'm getting on that bus

01:26:37.640 --> 01:26:39.360
♪ I'm in trouble

01:26:41.840 --> 01:26:43.680
♪ I'm in trouble

01:26:46.040 --> 01:26:49.520
♪ So, please come home

01:26:51.000 --> 01:26:54.040
♪ Please come home

01:26:55.320 --> 01:26:59.240
♪ Please come home

01:26:59.280 --> 01:27:01.760
♪ I'm in trouble

01:27:04.000 --> 01:27:08.120
♪ Yeah, please come home

01:27:08.160 --> 01:27:11.600
♪ Please come home

01:27:12.840 --> 01:27:18.480
♪ Please come home

01:27:18.520 --> 01:27:21.160
♪ I'm in trouble

01:27:23.000 --> 01:27:25.440
♪ I'm in trouble

01:27:27.000 --> 01:27:29.440
♪ I'm in trouble

01:27:31.000 --> 01:27:33.680
♪ I'm in trouble. ♪

01:27:48.000 --> 01:27:50.480
MUSIC: Remember Me
by Mouth Almighty

01:28:17.000 --> 01:28:20.760
♪ Well, your love left much
to be desired

01:28:20.800 --> 01:28:24.880
♪ You were everything
but not enough

01:28:24.920 --> 01:28:28.240
♪ Each tear you shed
is just another lie

01:28:28.280 --> 01:28:31.920
♪ Behind each smile, a sullen
scowl

01:28:31.960 --> 01:28:35.960
♪ Remember me, remember me

01:28:36.000 --> 01:28:38.880
♪ Won't you remember me

01:28:38.920 --> 01:28:43.480
♪ Oh, remember me, remember me

01:28:43.520 --> 01:28:46.760
♪ Won't you remember me

01:28:46.800 --> 01:28:50.040
♪ The lies you told
to pass the time

01:28:50.080 --> 01:28:53.720
♪ Well, I became accustomed to

01:28:53.760 --> 01:28:57.480
♪ But I no longer
need your closeness

01:28:57.520 --> 01:29:01.080
♪ You ripped
the wellness from my soul

01:29:01.120 --> 01:29:04.880
♪ Remember me, remember me

01:29:04.920 --> 01:29:07.800
♪ Won't you remember me

01:29:07.840 --> 01:29:12.320
♪ Oh, remember me, remember me

01:29:12.360 --> 01:29:15.120
♪ Won't you remember me

01:29:58.200 --> 01:30:01.960
♪ Don't call me
or call, call around

01:30:02.000 --> 01:30:05.680
♪ To say you've seen
the inner void

01:30:05.720 --> 01:30:09.240
♪ And leave with your
dead-hearted smile

01:30:09.280 --> 01:30:11.000
♪ Another while

01:30:11.040 --> 01:30:12.640
♪ Just a little bit more

01:30:12.680 --> 01:30:17.160
♪ Oh, remember me, remember me

01:30:17.200 --> 01:30:19.760
♪ Won't you remember me

01:30:19.800 --> 01:30:24.200
♪ Oh, remember me, remember me

01:30:24.240 --> 01:30:26.880
♪ Won't you remember me

01:30:26.920 --> 01:30:31.560
♪ Oh, remember me, remember me

01:30:31.600 --> 01:30:34.240
♪ Won't you remember me

01:30:34.280 --> 01:30:38.720
♪ Oh, remember me, remember me

01:30:38.760 --> 01:30:42.240
♪ Won't you remember. ♪